Official Kurak Alliance Thread: Veydreth

[cas]

The above is true. The predator is a gunship and deals horrifying damage if you can get it to your enemy undamaged. However in a full veydreth fleet its usual purpose is to distract the enemy from your other ships. Managing its use is one of the real challenges of a veydreth player. But if they gave it more defensive measures it would be monstrous.
 

In the words of one of my terran opponents who decided to shoot down my other stuff first. 'That thing only cost you 190 points!? That things nastier than my dreadnought!'. 

[N2OJoe]

Holy box of parts batman! I just got a Cruiser box and I'm a little disappointed that they aren't made to be swappable between light and heavy like the majors are.

I think I'm going to use the heavy engines with the light front end to make an Assault Cruiser because the smaller engines make it a look a bit squat and pudgy.

[Ryjak]

I would say none of the Cruiser boxes are really built to be swap able; this is a "new" feature with the Taskforce models, as they have locations for magnets.  One local player used a ton of magnets to make his Veydreth swapable... another simply bought two boxes.

[cas]

i used magnets to make mine swappable. Works fine.

[N2OJoe]

What did you do for the nose section? Just 1 in the middle or more around the edges?

[Hive]

You really need at least a second point of contact for stability.

[Bessemer]

I put two magnets in mine (3x1mm), that's enough to hold them. Placed them linearly, one below the other.

[cas]

I used one 3mm x1.5mm disc magnet in each piece. Used a dremel hollow out a space for them. Since the noses are only plastic and fairly light it works fine. 

[Specky]

I recently got a box of Veydreth Gunships cause they were on sale at a local store. I love the models, but playing mostly games at 800pts, I find it hard to put them in a list as they are Tier 1s.

How do people run theirs at 800pts or is it not worth the battle log liability?

[cas]

They are most certainly good at 800 points. They can suffer substantial damage before giving up battle log even if the battle log is higher than in larger games. They have to kill two gunships before they get a measly 2 BL, then hunt down the third one for the huge swing. Its not hard to get the third gunship out of the way. In return the amount of pain they can put out on a smaller fleet is devastating. Its hard to describe how much of a patrol fleet they can kill.

My standard goto veydreth 800 point list is:

• Corvettes +Mines x5
• Destroyers + high energy x3
• Gunships x3
• Predator +2MV +2MN

The gunships are the star of the show here, they and the corvettes reserve, the destroyers use stealth systems to survive while the predator does its best to survive behind terrain. If they spend enough time to kill the gunships the predator gets in range and mulches them. Usually what happens is the gunships roll up out of fold space and kill everything.

 

[Kaptin Klepto]

What allies go well with Veydreth?  

[N2OJoe]

SRS allies IMO. Starting with a Predator or Gunships on the board leaves time for plenty of double mines to be dropped and make it difficult for hostile shunters, while also protecting your fleet on the approach.

[cas]

Tarakians, tarakians and more tarakians. 

Veydreth force people to spread out ships where tarakians force people to cluster in order to avoid being gravitically shoved into planets. This severely limits where and how your opponent can fly.
Perhaps im just bringing tactics from other games where board control is more a dominant game feature but this is a brutal combination that takes an experienced opponent to play against. Not recommended for playing against new people however.

[Ryjak]

I don't see how gravity weapons force you to cluster; I'd say their presence creates a 4" no-fly zone around Planetoids and the Table edge.

Which games are you playing where board control is dominant, and what are these 'tactics' you use within them?

[Commodore Jones]

3 hours ago, Ryjak said:

I don't see how gravity weapons force you to cluster; I'd say their presence creates a 4" no-fly zone around Planetoids and the Table edge.

It forces clustering through that no-fly zone you mentioned. It's not just planetoids and table edges, while not insta-kill other terrain types can be still be very nasty. And your opponent may keep to that 4" no go zone just to avoid 5 to 10 dice damage or potential Disorder Checks.

 

[Ryjak]

Odd... I don't think it's ever forced my Dindrenzi to cluster.  Then again, their FF Weapons make them do that anyway.

[Captain_Dan]

Tarakians + Veydreth minefields = Fun   lol

The only odd thing is the Carnivore which has no mines. I have been puzzled for a while about this ship and I like to share my thoughts:

The DR/CR, Movement CP, AP and PD are average for a heavy cruiser. As  I said is the only Veydreth ship without mines which is an odd thing for Veydreth. Has no shields but instead (the other stat of remark) it has 6 HP. This is both a bless and a curse. It makes the ship hard to kill but feeds extra BL to the enemy if an squadron of those gets completely whiped out.

Speaking about firepower, I have been comparing them with other major powers' heavy cruisers. They seem at first glance a bit undergunned, in fact they seem to have regular cruiser firepower (and some standard cruisers such as Directorate and Sorylian ones have even better firepower, but these ones are exceptions above-the-average for a cruiser). Terrans HCs have turrets that makes them outgun the Carnivores in one arc. Similar case for Aquan HC with their energy transfer and Sorylian HC are just better, but only at a close range.

So what does the Carnivore has to offer? Consistency and multi-arc. The HC has adequate range and firepower at EVERY firing arc (not just one arc like Terrans, Aquans and Dindrenzi), they even have good weapon arcs (no FF arcs) and Torpedoes and fore weaponry share same arc (multi arc). The torpedoes are good, specially at close range.

So what´s their role and the best way to use them? They are there to soak up damage, just like the Battleship. They take damage more easily than a Predator but in turn, a full squadron of those has a lot of HPs. Just make sure they shunt out of the battlefield before they got whiped out (an easy task if you don't get too much"carried away" while shooting stuff... ) Don´t forget the arc thing: you have a full fore arc (opposed to fixed fore or FF arc), so try to have at least two targets within two arcs (PLUS the torpedo arc) most of the time. I think Carnivores are used best when you reveal your ships out of Ambush the turn in which most of the ships will be within RB of each other so the opponent has to choose between focusing on your HCs or firing a those nasty well-placed gunships....

 

Hope you find it useful!

 

Dan

 

[N2OJoe]

They have BB level PD. I find the lack of mines odd as well because they really want to start on the table and chew on torps, but as the only un-mined ship in the fleet, you would really rather have something else dropping mines as it advances up the field. I think this is also supposed to be their anti SRS ship because Veydreth have no srs of their own.

The 6th HP is supposed to make it tougher as well, although 6 really doesn't give you much more survivability than 5 because it's an even number and one extra crit will finish off either way. It does hit your own Battle Log though.

Their extra firepower is also nice in a CL squadron if you are not focused exclusively on Mines or Boarding, though both are still adequate with the CA in the lead.

[Ryjak]

The squadron can potentially fire 3x14 AD into an enemy squadron; that's sure to leave a mark.

[Ryjak]

The squadron can potentially fire 3x14 AD into an enemy squadron; that's sure to leave a mark.

These guys are slightly more resilient than Dindrenzi Heavy Cruisers, but they want to get up close and personal.  Thus, I suggest using Shunt Entry to safely get them to optimal range.

[Captain_Dan]

In a pure Veydreth fleet they are there to absorb some damage and, as Joe said, to provide some anti-SRS coverage. A pure Veydreth player probably will be looking to shunt / flank / ambush some other nastier stuff

 

[Ryjak]

True, if you have to start something on the table, the Heavy Cruisers are ok, but I'd say the Battleship and Corvettes are better in this role.  However, you could build a null deployment fleet and start with nothing.

[N2OJoe]

So I was wanting to take Omnidyne Escort CV's in my Veydreth fleet but to my surprise, their Fleet List does not allow for ANY Escort Carriers at any points level.

I wonder if this is intentional or that it just hasn't been updated since the introduction of non-big 6 Escort Carriers.

[Ryjak]

Neither Support Fleet Guide has been updated since Escort Carriers were introduced, so they are not in the Fleet Selection Charts.

That said, they are consistently a Tier 2 choice, and you are allowed 1/2/3 Squadrons in your Fleet.

[N2OJoe]

Idea for the Heavy Cruiser: How about a Hardpoint to make them really want to start on the table?

Free (+5 Mines, -2AD to all Beam Weapons).

This would make them perfect for starting on the table and fit their lore as being designed to fly towards the enemy and be a distraction/absorb fire for the rest of the fleet to get into position. They would still have good AD on the short range Fore weapons (until they get shot up on the way in) and be focused on flying all the way up into short range to brawl with their Fore weapons, decent boarding, and strong short range Torpedoes, while covering the backfield on the way in.