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Official Kurak Alliance Thread: Hawker Industries

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Here are my two lists that i used at Adepticon to take 5th place, and nearly much higher if i had had one more turn in the last game Each list is 1000 points exactly. Feel free to ask any questions

 

This list i used 3 times:

 

TIER 1

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
1x (Alliance) | Excelsior Class Battleship | Large | 170 | [1] | Wings: 0
(Hardpoint) | Cyberwarfare Weapons | Excelsior (3/1) | +20
(Hardpoint) | +1" Mv | Excelsior (3/2) | +5
(Hardpoint) | +1 HP | Excelsior (3/1) | +10
(Upgrade) | Secured Bulkheads MAR | Excelsior | +5
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
1x (Alliance) | Excelsior Class Battleship | Large | 170 | [1] | Wings: 0
(Hardpoint) | Cyberwarfare Weapons | Excelsior (3/1) | +20
(Hardpoint) | +1 HP | Excelsior (3/1) | +10
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
TIER 2
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
3x (Alliance) | Resolute Class Cruiser | Medium | 180 | [2,3] | Wings: 0
(Upgrade) | Weapon Shilding MAR | Resolute x3 | +30
(Upgrade) | Turrets to Nuclear Weapons | Resolute x3 | +15
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
3x (Alliance) | Makalu Class Torpedo Cruiser | Medium | 180 | [2,3] | Wings: 0
(Upgrade) | Torpedo Weapons: Corrosive MAR | Makalu x3 | +30
(Hardpoint) | +2" Mv | Makalu x3 (1/1) | +15
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
TIER 3
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2x (Alliance) | Endeavour Class Frigate | Small | 70 | [2,4] | Wings: 0
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2x (Alliance) | Endeavour Class Frigate | Small | 70 | [2,4] | Wings: 0
 
This list I used once:
 
TIER 1
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
1x (Alliance) | Excelsior Class Battleship | Large | 170 | [1] | Wings: 0
(Hardpoint) | Cyberwarfare Weapons | Excelsior (3/1) | +20
(Hardpoint) | +1 HP | Excelsior (3/1) | +10
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
TIER 2
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
3x (Alliance) | Resolute Class Cruiser | Medium | 180 | [2,3] | Wings: 0
(Upgrade) | Weapon Shilding MAR | Resolute x3 | +30
(Upgrade) | Turrets to Nuclear Weapons | Resolute x3 | +15
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
3x (Alliance) | Resolute Class Cruiser | Medium | 180 | [2,3] | Wings: 0
(Upgrade) | Weapon Shilding MAR | Resolute x3 | +30
(Upgrade) | Turrets to Nuclear Weapons | Resolute x3 | +15
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
3x (Alliance) | Makalu Class Torpedo Cruiser | Medium | 180 | [2,3] | Wings: 0
(Upgrade) | Torpedo Weapons: Corrosive MAR | Makalu x3 | +30
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
TIER 3
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2x (Alliance) | Endeavour Class Frigate | Small | 70 | [2,4] | Wings: 0
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2x (Alliance) | Endeavour Class Frigate | Small | 70 | [2,4] | Wings: 0

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It was two-fold. First I looked hard at the mission and tried to think what i needed more of. Did I need lots of bodies on the field to control various objectives, like in the gun platforms missions? Then I took the list with more Tier 2 ships. Did I need something that had to carry an objective with it in order to live like in the first mission where a kind of SRS token flew and docked with my ship? Well the double battleship is way more survivable for that.

 

In two missions where neither of those mattered too much I looked at what fleet my opponent was using. Both against Terqui with his multitude of torp spam and the ability to assault, the Battleships made more sense.

 

It made even more sense against the Sorylians i faced round 4 (which if i had played just a tad smarter would have tied me in mission points against the guy who won it all!) who i knew was running a Tier 1 heavy list (in fact he ran 2 battleships and 1 dread) where survive-ability meant A LOT. And long term effectiveness matters, which is something that our battleships excel at.

 

As for what I might want to change, I might consider taking away nukes turrets on and secure bulkheads on the first list and grabbing some kind of decent escort for my admiral, but I am not sure. 

 

Oh, as for tac-cards that I took every game was Regroup to make my frigates into one squad and Drives to Maximum to get in there and get dirty with my Gun Racks on the Makalus and Resolutes 

Then depending on the mission or if I planned on having guys in reserve I took Perfect Timing, if i was not having anyone in reserve I took Power to Shields.

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Also, people I have looked through some of these lists.

 

Weapon Shielding on your Resolutes is a MUST, it is VITALLY important to the ship if you want it to have any kind of staying power, which is the entire idea behind a 5hp ship. Having a squad still deal 12 dice even if they are all at 1 hp with weapon shielding vs 5 dice without.... its not even a challance

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Having played one game with a hawker fleet (vs dinz long range vs short range game) I am wondering if you got much from the cyber warfare weapons ? The excelsior was my ship of the match for that game even without it so I am very tempted to use it next game

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Cyberwarfare sometimes runs hot and sometimes runs cold. The thing that I have found about it that works best is to try and keep yourself from firing at T1s unless they are the only target. It is great against T2s as 4 hits isnt that hard to get on 9 nice and buring through their crew is great. Against T3s is where the ideal situation lies, because of how easily they can kill a ship so keep that in mind. but do not try to use it against elusive targets, you just do not have enough dice to hit on 6s.... again, unless no other target is there.

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Against Dindrenzi I used Cyberwarfare against tier 2's and tier 1's when other targets aren't readily in range. Usually targeting Weapon Systems, being able to halve or even shut down the forward weapons of a Dindrenzi ship is awesome, Defensive systems is another fave target of mine.

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Ok, with a lot of ships being tweaked recently, can we talk about the Stalwart?

 

To put it bluntly, 20pts is over costed for what it does. Granted 4/5 is solid, and CP of 3 protects against de-crewing from cyber/debris fields etc, but does nothing special for 20pts

 

compared to other Kurak escorts...

 

Tearran- Squire: 15pts, lower DR/CR and CP, but can synergise with shield projectors and the Power To Shields card. Can't rely on shields, of course, but both those things help!

               Nadir (Escort Hardpoint): same DR/CR, same CP, +1 AP, +3 Mv and 2 shields (fully upgraded) , +5 pts and -1 PD. Not as good for defence, but a bugger to get rid of, especially with shield projectors and playing PTS!

 

If your playing Terrans, you wouldn't take the Stalwart at all.

 

Soryilian: Kontos: +1 Mv, AP and PD, -1 DR and CP. Same cost.

 

I reckon the Lizards are happy to keep their escort. 4 PD! No contest.

 

Aquans: Kappa: +2 Mv and Mn, -1 CP, Minefields (1, 6AD), same cost and PD

 

The premier Kurak escort! As I hear it, many player are more than happy to take this, and why wouldn't you? Good PD, mines and minefeilds? Don't wrap 'em, I'll take as is:D

 

Xelocian: Larshan: (Pending)

 

All the above offer something for any Kurak player that the Stalwart just doesn't. Needless to say the Stalwart needs something.

 

These are my suggestions...

 

a). As is, reduce to 15pts. By far the simplest option.

b ). Sector Shielding. Gives a boost whilst still having a weakness, shields of 0 and all.

c). Reinforced (fore), or even Reinforced (fore, Port and Starboard). would need clarification for how reinforced would work for multiple arcs, however.

d). 3 HP. Make the Stalwart the "Brick" Escort. The most radical option and probably least likely to get any support.

 

Does anyone agree with these? What would you offer if not? 

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I do think the stalwart is slightly overpriced for what it is. But too good for 15pt. What I'd like to see is a price increase, maybe lose 1PD and gain a support MAR so it is more like the RSN siren.

Balancing escorts for the support fleets is tricky though as there is no negatives associated to taking whichever is best for your fleet.

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2 ideas:

Either 1.: All the other Hawker ships have fore torpedoes, maybe give the Stalwart some, too? Not a lot, 1 or 2 dice in RB1 and 2 only.

Or 2.: Point Defense Barrage MAR. It's more of a Ryushi-thing, I admit, but they've got that extended PD range thingy, too, which the Stalwarts wouldn't have.

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I'd completely forgot about PD barrage....problem is it only really works with Bigger Batteries. Speaking of which, that would be another way to go. That being said, if the future of T3 is boxes for all factions, the Ryushi may be getting a ship with similar properties. Trying to give a "Hawker" feel to the Stalwart without stepping on anyone else's toes. 

 

The Xelocian one will probably be the Kurak "gun" Escort, but Cyberwarfare would fit, maybe along the lines of 4/3/-/-? You'd be Linking rather than Combining, so this would boost an Excelsior/Regent's CW without making it OP. maybe even making it fore only rather than all round.

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Link here for anyone wanting a butchers! http://community.spartangames.co.uk/index.php?/topic/2833-official-kurak-alliance-thread-hawker-industries/page-14

I like it! I'd make it 4/3/-/- or 3/4/-/-, though. Having RB3 is too good for an Escort in my view.

I wanted to at first but I thought it would have made a linked Cyberwarfare attack too powerful. I wanted to give the Cyber guns a boost but not have them outperform a dedicated Cyberwarfare squadron like the Directorate R&D cruisers.

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It's actually had an army painter wash on it, it is darker than it looks in that photo though not as dark as I'd hoped. 

 

You're right about the strong tone being not quite right for metal. That's the ink wash I have. Up close its made it look a bit rusty in places which I'm ok with but just didn't darken the silver as much as I'd hoped. 

 

But for now I'm happy. It's a damn sight better than any of my previous model painting attempts 

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Has anyone tried shunting in the Regent Carrier with  2 Resolute Cruisers, all with Nuclear Turrets? 

They can link for 14 AD with Nuclear Turrets which is respectable, or combine their broadside for a whopping 22 AD (highest AD-pool Hawker Industries can reach on their own.)

I'm thinking about trying this list in my next 1200 pts game;

1x Regent Carrier /w 6 bombers, Nuclear Turrets, Weapon Shielding* - 185 pts (Admiral)
2x Resolute Cruiser Accompaniments /w Nuclear Turrets, Weapon Shielding* - 150 pts

3x Resolute Cruisers /w Weapon Shielding* - 210 pts
(*Yes, I'm a fan of Weapon Shielding, it allows the Resolutes to be a threat until they die.)

4x Endeavour Frigates - 140 pts
4x Endeavour Frigates - 140 pts

1x Hulaka Dreadnaught /w +1 Shield, -1 Turn Limit, Corrosive Beams, 3 Interceptors - 375 pts. (Mostly because this is my newest toy and I love the model.)

Deploy the Dreadnaught and Cruisers on the table and protect them with the Interceptors, and shunt in the Carrier and Frigates. (Or deploy the frigates if you dont want push your luck.)

The Carrier+Cruiser Squadron is alot of point, but when they arrive they can dish out some serious damage at optimal range; 14 AD Nuclear Turret, 12 AD Starboard / Port, 9-11 AD Fore Torpedoes, 18 AD from the Bombers and then just for the sheer hell of it, board something with those 10 AP if theres anything close by.
 

 

 

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my only issue is that the carrier is a real easy 6 points for your opponent to score. I find carriers largely underwhelming but as an admiral boat, they're garbage (except probably directorate)

that Xelocian dred might be my new favorite miniature.  

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Points permitting a carrier with capital escort shunt bomb has been pretty nasty for me in the past. I've only had a handful of games using the regent and the few where I started it on the board it didn't last long enough to be very useful. On the flip side it's a psychologically frightening group to put off to the side of the board during deployment and usually mulches a squad or puts a good dent into a Tier 1 upon arrival. I really think the excelsior is superior for an admiral because of its durability and op center, personally.

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