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Further update from someone who saw Stuart today

'Looks like v3 will be coming out early next year, with Crown and Union coming out first. Other forces will be coming out on a monthly basis with a battle force first, and then smaller ships available the following month.'

So that's some great news, but at second hand.

Also the contact was told by Stuart that the attached picture represented the British starter set.  I hope that's just the model types and not the exact box set, because seven models seems a bit limited, and there are some upgrade sprues for differing patterns of each model otherwise it might be a little underwhelming, especially compared to more generous Spartan sets with all the tokens, full complement of cruisers, battlecruiser, corvettes, and light carrier.

Battle box set.jpg

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If I recall right weren't the tokens in Spartan sets just printed card (not perforated pop-out card), so whilst it was additional content it was cheaper than we might get in a dedicated token set. I don't mind reduced content since we don't yet know any prices, plus it sounds like they are aiming for quite a fast year if they can do 1 faction a month and support other factions with smaller ship releases. 

 

Next year is a shame, but at the same time, personally, the end of this year is shaping up t obe expensive so I can't complain at having more time to clear the decks for fresh ships and purchases

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Just now, Overread said:

If I recall right weren't the tokens in Spartan sets just printed card (not perforated pop-out card), so whilst it was additional content it was cheaper than we might get in a dedicated token set. I don't mind reduced content since we don't yet know any prices, plus it sounds like they are aiming for quite a fast year if they can do 1 faction a month and support other factions with smaller ship releases. 

I don't mind card tokens, since they are cheap and easy to replace.  I just wanted the game accessible, and for a beginner box to feel like a full fleet, so I hope the starter fleet is Spartan sized, and I hope that the options that Warcradle tout for these different options are included, so both Classic Battleship and 'funky' version be it, electro-shock therapy from the FSA or whale torture from the Covenant.

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I did forget about the 2 bombers, mostly because they were not a full squadron and as such, annoying rather than helpful in a game where the only way to field anything was in max squad sizes. I would far more appreciate if the starter boxes included full squadrons, rather than more, but incomplete ones, such as Spartan liked to do. As for the tokens, my personal view is that tokens are the spawn of devil, and the fewer of them in any game the better, but yes ,a sheet of them would be nice in the starter too.

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Comon... card token as provided by Spartan can be made unlimited by a printer and some cardboard/plasticard for next to no cost by yourself. You even can do high quality stuff yourself in terms of tokens if you really want to. In my opinion that extra stuff you got in Spartan boxes were not really worth that much.

As to the number of models I really don't care how many you get to a box as long as you can buy models individually as well so you can get the ships that you like in the quantity you like it. 

The most important thing is the quality of the models and the options you get to put them together. Being able to magnetise options so you can alter between weapons and equipment as you see fit etc...

I'm pretty sure Warcradle models will be more expensive per model but also better quality products in general, I don't see the problem with this.

 

What I personally don't like is boxes of models if you can't get the models individually as well. I like to decide myself what I get and how many of each model I get to own. I don't want to buy four frigates for every battleship I like to own for example. If this is the case I might perhaps not buy anything at all... I'm mostly in it for the models I like to own, paint and put on the board. I don't care one bit about what is the best thing to put on the board in any way. I don't spend hours and hours painting up tons of cruiser because they are the best and then they nerf them the next day so now I need mostly frigates... that is a waste of time for me.

 

Just give me some nice looking models to buy... I prefer boxes with relatively few models... mainly basics for new players to get a minimum required starter fleet. Then we can buy ships individually to get the ships we want. Sure, some of the smaller you might need to buy in sets of two or three models, that is OK. So cruisers you perhaps buy in sets of two while frigates are bought in sets of four.

 

Tokens and movement templates I don't need to buy at all... I just prefer to make them myself from downloadable templates, easy to do and I get as many as I can ever need them. I don't need special dice either... regular dice work just fine for me. Making stuff is part of the hobby and I probably spend 9/10 hours modelling and stuff rather than playing anyway... ;) 

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I don't mind fewer models so long as the number is functional within the game and comparable to squad sizes. So if you get 3 frigates then I'd hope that frigate groups cap at a multiple of 3 and increase by single or multiple of three models. That way you can just buy another starting box and continue to expand the fleet without waste.

 

I'm also open to them doing boxed sets a bit like Planetfall, indeed the helix system was very interesting in that it helped out on two fronts:

1) It defeated unit spam by giving players diverse pre-designed unit blocks so you couldn't break things so easily with min-maxing units.

2) It helped keep the stocking and shelfspace down. this is a big concern for games because you are only going to have limited space at most stores. So if you can get more models by having more boxed sets instead of dozens of blisters then that can really help. IT also makes the game simpler to newbies even once the armies have increased in diversity. 

 

 

That said however they come I just want to see more models appearing. It was such a shame spartan shut down the way they did when their armies were getting thick with diversity and creativity. I'm sure I'm not alone in wanting to see what Warcradle has come up with and to see a return of some old favourites and ideas and new twists! Huge hovering mecha-squids; vast sky carriers; machine sea monsters, whales with bombs strapped to them like a torpe...oh wait we got that! :)

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Agreed.  My biggest concern was that we got two cruisers when as a you have max unit size of three.  But I do think its important a starter boxed set allows a player to start, so preferably a nice round minimum play set, tokens for newbies and a reference stat sheet or cards.  It's all very saying you don't need all that if you have been playing since the year dot, but Warcradle have stressed again and again and again they want new fans, hence they should make it as easy as possible to get involved.

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5 hours ago, Pok said:

Fairly sure that was part of the problem. I know I lost interest fast when they started releasing mecha-dragons and floating statues of liberty.

Then you really aren't going to be keen on Warcradle's stated vision for the game. 

Quote

"I think it's important to acknowledge that visually the game is going to embrace and evolve the more outlandish concepts from second edition Dystopian Wars rather than keeping it in the ‘could happen' vibe of the first edition. So more iceberg ships and robot dragons and less WWI German battleships. Our design team, while respectful of influences and inspiration found in the real world, are much more stylistically led rather than continuing the pseudo-historical feel of what went on before. For some that means the designs are going to be going in a direction that is not for them. The ships of the Dystopian Age are not ships you would honestly expect to find in real life (with or without Stirginium), but as playing pieces in a war game we want to make sure they are visually distinctive and exciting. In that regard Dystopian Wars will have much more in common with the design philosophies behind sci-fi and fantasy games like Warmachine than historical games like Flames of War."

 

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While I'm excited to see what the new version of DW by Warcradle is going to look like, I'm quite concerned about my amassed DW fleets. I don't want to throw them away and I would really like to be able to play them with the new rules. I know, if they do choose not to support them anymore, I can keep playing the old rules or come up with house rules. But I still hope that's not going to be the case. 

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On 10/14/2019 at 11:35 AM, end0r said:

While I'm excited to see what the new version of DW by Warcradle is going to look like, I'm quite concerned about my amassed DW fleets. I don't want to throw them away and I would really like to be able to play them with the new rules. I know, if they do choose not to support them anymore, I can keep playing the old rules or come up with house rules. But I still hope that's not going to be the case. 

From what I can gather many older ships will get updated designs in the new game. For example the core sets are already featuring battleships, cruisers and frigates as standard. So you should be able to swap-in many of your old ships as counts as under the new ships. Of course some specialist units might not return; others might take a long while to come out and some might change quite dramatically in size and scale from what they once were.

So I don't expect it to work perfectly, but I think old fleets will still be viable; just using legacy models. 

I don't expect WC to release rules specifically for the old designs. It would split the community and also the rules would either be on the whole weaker (thus old ships would feel redundant) or could end up better which would feel like old players have an advantage over new customers who can only buy the newer ships (I don't know how long WC will keep legacy casting going for). 

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32 minutes ago, Overread said:

From what I can gather many older ships will get updated designs in the new game. For example the core sets are already featuring battleships, cruisers and frigates as standard. So you should be able to swap-in many of your old ships as counts as under the new ships. Of course some specialist units might not return; others might take a long while to come out and some might change quite dramatically in size and scale from what they once were.

So I don't expect it to work perfectly, but I think old fleets will still be viable; just using legacy models. 

I don't expect WC to release rules specifically for the old designs. It would split the community and also the rules would either be on the whole weaker (thus old ships would feel redundant) or could end up better which would feel like old players have an advantage over new customers who can only buy the newer ships (I don't know how long WC will keep legacy casting going for). 

I don't think that not releasing rules would split the community worse since you'd have a lot of fans with a ruleset and fluff that's a big adjustment and then making their fleets unplayable would produce a natural jumping off point to stick to 2.5 or 2.0 and grumble worse then they are already,   If there is a current gap in WC's range then they should aim to fill it once the moulds have dried up.  

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I would mainly be worried about balancing an incredibly large range of models right on release, @RuleBritannia. A new system would need time to settle, balance wise, before new models are introduced that might upset it. I am mildly upset at the very, very large amount of painted miniatures I cannot call upon when I would play 3rd edition, but I would understand them not wanting to create statistics for "unreleased" units.

At this point, though, I really would like to get my hands on a complete ruleset. I've done some playtesting early in the beta, but it is hard to get people to play a game without faction differentiation or a solid army building mechanism.

PS., please get my black wolf in there again soon, I miss them so :(

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37 minutes ago, varnos said:

I would mainly be worried about balancing an incredibly large range of models right on release, @RuleBritannia. A new system would need time to settle, balance wise, before new models are introduced that might upset it. I am mildly upset at the very, very large amount of painted miniatures I cannot call upon when I would play 3rd edition, but I would understand them not wanting to create statistics for "unreleased" units.

They are going to be staggering releases they can stagger the updated stats.  Either way leaving a generation behind seems foolish and somewhat arrogant after the time taken.

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Yes, we have been playing the beta as well and the core mechanics worked quite well, even preventing one friend of mine to completely jump off the DW bandwagon. He didn't like the complexity and slowness of the old rules, which is better in the beta. But it's desperately missing the faction diversity.

I do agree, leaving the playing DW generation behind would be foolish and arrogant. I also have a large amount of painted minis in several fleets. Those ships look great and I'd like to see them in the new DW world as well.  I could use most of them with the beta rules, so I'd expect it to stay like that. I don't actually need separate statistics for them, I just would like to have the same categories being kept, so I can still use most of them. It's not about introducing new models, but rather keeping the old ones, just like they kept a good portion of the rules as well.

 

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