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Overread

What do you wish/hope/want from the high seas?

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So it seems that Warcradle have plans to bring the fantasy world of Uncharted Seas back to life. So whilst its likely to be well over a year before this game will surface it might be neat to have some chats on what we'd like to see in the game (get a few thoughts in early before WC sets their plans in full motion). 

Of course for most of us just having the game viable again and getting models support would be a huge thing and more than enough! 

 

A few thoughts from myself

1) Artwork - one thing I think that helps sell some franchises is artwork that sets a tone, style and sparks the imagination on players. Especially if some things are not always fully realised in the models that are released (due to scale and the practical limitations of miniatures).  If sticking to the games original lore it would be things like the bright magical bolts the Dragon Lords used; rank and file of undead pulling at the oars for Bone Griffons; 

2) Rules varied from the other games - a core rules system is easier to work with, but it would be good to have a system of rules that more reflects the fact that many ships will be using wind or other forms of motion. I think wind direction should be a feature of this game, even if many of the factions might well have work arounds 

3) Beasts - I don't just mean within the factions themselves*, but sea monsters and the like. I think its a good way to add some larger monsters into the game as well as some more unique battle objectives and scenarios other than the standard "capture points" or "destroy opponent" ones. 

4) Sea forts and coastline installations. Whilst I don't expect to see a land wargame**, I think that another way to both give flavour to the factions and provide more senarios and game types is to have forts to siege; ports to take; harbours to blockade etc...

 

 

*I fully expect whales with frekkin harpoons on their heads! ;)

**My impression is that the scale ideal for warships isn't ideal for land units, esp when a fantasy game would have a heavier reliance on infantry as opposed to Dystopian Wars which managed because most of its units were large machines and tanks. 

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Excellent thoughts and words there @Overread I agree. 

Scenarios would suit this game well. Adding to the Beasts.. How about a Hunt the White Wale (harpoon hat optional) scenario. Trying to capture/kill a beast while your enemies are also on the hunt. 

With Seaforts/Ports it makes Blockade scenarios possible. 

How about less armed transport ships. Then making sure the cargo gets through is more important than attacking your opponent. 

I am glad there is hope for this game. 

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Re-release the game as is

i’d Be fine with some sort of rules for coastal fort assault ( hence only needing infantry tokens without need for cavalry , hoplites , etc)

release a new faction for the north: ice floe that rams as frigates, longships as mediums, and large ships that can cast ice storms 

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First I will say I have no experience with Uncharted Seas as of yet, other than reading about it lately, but it looks like a good time.

I definitely think good artwork can really help a game out, and agree that it can help depict things like the crews of ships that really won't show on models, you make a good point there Overread.

I rather like everything WestAustralian said, about hunting beasts, and running weakly armed transports or supplies past blockades.

I also would agree with Fracas, that coastal fort assaults would be neat, but that avoiding a need for anything beyond simple infantry tokens would be best so as not to over-complicate things outside the naval focus of the game.

I see a scenario where there are multiple islands bases for various players, all trying to get unarmed cargo ships to some central and hotly contested loot site, and then back to their own ports, which other players may or may not try to blockade. Admittedly I have no idea how that would work, other than that it sounds like it would be cool.
In my rampant imagination, perhaps it is a campaign, with each player building a reputation and fleet out of their ports, sailing in search of rare beasts to harvest for resources, or lost islands hiding buried treasure. Again, no idea how that would all game out, but I have an imagination, you know? 

In any event, I am looking forward to whatever far-flung future date brings news on the developments of the game.

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David that last idea is basically done in other games through a campaign system. Although in practice you don't tend to get huge changes between armies based on victories - otherwise you can end up with one person winning a few early matches then having a serious power advantage over many of the others; similarly anyone losing a few early matches gets so far behind that they will end up near auto losing most that follow. 

But yes that can be done - buying new ships and building up a fleet  - a growth campaign - is a staple of wargaming (it often goes hand in hand with introducing a group of people to the game - they collect and build a fleet over a few months of campaign gaming and slowly grow their collection up that way - with each other providing support and known games each week to play). 

 

 

Western - yes transport ship escorting! I know Dystopian at its height was producing more regular ships for games and I think pairing those with scenarios, in-game lore/stories and such can really make a huge difference to their uptake. 

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On 1/15/2018 at 11:10 PM, Overread said:

So it seems that Warcradle have plans to bring the fantasy world of Uncharted Seas back to life. So whilst its likely to be well over a year before this game will surface it might be neat to have some chats on what we'd like to see in the game (get a few thoughts in early before WC sets their plans in full motion). 

Of course for most of us just having the game viable again and getting models support would be a huge thing and more than enough! 

 

A few thoughts from myself

1) Artwork - one thing I think that helps sell some franchises is artwork that sets a tone, style and sparks the imagination on players. Especially if some things are not always fully realised in the models that are released (due to scale and the practical limitations of miniatures).  If sticking to the games original lore it would be things like the bright magical bolts the Dragon Lords used; rank and file of undead pulling at the oars for Bone Griffons; 

2) Rules varied from the other games - a core rules system is easier to work with, but it would be good to have a system of rules that more reflects the fact that many ships will be using wind or other forms of motion. I think wind direction should be a feature of this game, even if many of the factions might well have work arounds 

3) Beasts - I don't just mean within the factions themselves*, but sea monsters and the like. I think its a good way to add some larger monsters into the game as well as some more unique battle objectives and scenarios other than the standard "capture points" or "destroy opponent" ones. 

4) Sea forts and coastline installations. Whilst I don't expect to see a land wargame**, I think that another way to both give flavour to the factions and provide more senarios and game types is to have forts to siege; ports to take; harbours to blockade etc...

 

 

*I fully expect whales with frekkin harpoons on their heads! ;)

**My impression is that the scale ideal for warships isn't ideal for land units, esp when a fantasy game would have a heavier reliance on infantry as opposed to Dystopian Wars which managed because most of its units were large machines and tanks. 

Uncharted Seas is the original, Firestorm Armada and  Dystopian Wars are based on it, not the other way around.

The rules system suits fantasy naval combat better than it does space combat as a result.

Wind direction is already incorporated in the game, as are various magical creatures & sea monsters, as are coastal fortifications & sea forts, so I wonder what you're about here (?)

 

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Well for my part, I am new enough to the thing I only know what people have told me and the little bit I have read online or seen in pictures. So as for what I am about here, I guess just talking about something that looks exciting to me, and learning from others about it, while waiting for something official to be announced.

I think it is neat that sea forts and wind direction etc. are already in the rules, that sounds great. And as for it being a better system for fantasy naval combat than other things, what I have learned from these various forums does certainly imply that to me, which is all the more reason why I am excited for whatever eventually comes of this.

As you and everyone else here probably knows more than me about it, I would be glad of it if you would share more about the game, so a landlubber like me can learn!

Thanks!

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Frans - from memory the monsters and coastal defences were only "just" in the game itself. I think there were 3 or so random monsters and coastal defences were either generic or dwarven, rather than themed to each specific key race. Wind I threw in more as a "don't take it out" aspect (since considering how many factions in Uncharted could work without wind it could be removed and still function)

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The current sailing model is simplistic and doesn’t account for the differences in sail configuration.

Fortifications are generic, a bit 17th century style, but stats for a number of different fortification types are available, so you could build a harbour/fortification more fitting to the faction you’re playing.

There also exists a generic (wooden) floating harbour, which could be used for most factions, and the dwarfs have their own floating harbour/fortress.

Monster there are aplenty, all the usual suspects are available.

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After pouring over the old lore and reading the rules (thanks to a kind forum member sharing them with me!) I can certainly say I second WestAustralian's statement.
I have high hopes for what the future holds for this game!

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I wouldn't expect nor hope for any news until both Dystopian Wars and Firestorm Armarda are on the market. Even then it might have to be after the land versions of both those games come out. Uncharted needs the most work of any of the games; even right now WC could just roll with the old sculpts for the other games; but Uncharted still needed revamping at the end of its life (whilst the quality had gone up, many of the sculpts were old and showed their age - the Dragon Lord ships are very plain and mostly just wooden boarding on the hull - a couple of their last ships released were far more detailed with metal banding and windows etc... and its clear that the ships of Dystopian and FA prove that the overall quality could be improved far further). 

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As far as I know the entire UCS range got resculpted, and the only range still missing models was the Sky Pirates fleet.

Quality wise these miniatures are as good as the most recent FA/DW stuff.

I honestly haven't a clue why Warcradle don't simply start casting the UCS miniatures again.

F.

 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, Frans said:

As far as I know the entire UCS range got resculpted, and the only range still missing models was the Sky Pirates fleet.

Quality wise these miniatures are as good as the most recent FA/DW stuff.

I honestly haven't a clue why Warcradle don't simply start casting the UCS miniatures again.

F.

There are two issues, limited access to moulds and whether Warcradle cares that much for Spartan's range since it is some ways a competitor for Warcradle's somewhat different vision.

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9 minutes ago, RuleBritannia said:

There are two issues, limited access to moulds and whether Warcradle cares that much for Spartan's range since it is some ways a competitor for Warcradle's somewhat different vision.

As far as I know, except for the Halo stuff, they bought the whole caboodle, including UCS.

I suspect issue two has more to do with it, or they simply aren’t interested, in which case, in the interest of the UCS players community, they should pass the stuff on to someone who is.

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Don't forget whilst the Uncharted Seas miniatures got updated moulds the actual sculpts of many are very dated. The Dragon Lords really show this. If you compare their regular ships the hulls, whilst having nice panel detailing, are exceptionally boring and bare of detail or even ship-like styles and features. Not even anchor holes and the rear window is very "slapped on". They were very early sculpts and if you compare the designs to a lot of the newer stuff that Spartan did, esp for Dystopian Wars, you can REALLY see that they came a long way. Even the Invoker new ships were a world apart from the earlier designs. 

 

Of all the Spartan ranges this one would need a re-vamp in terms of updating sculpts for many of the races. Sadly it was also the most dead in the water even before Spartan closed doors. Chances are even if WC have the moulds a good few might be broken/damaged beyond casting quality (esp since they'd put the range on mail-order only and had run it down heavily so chances are many moulds just never got replaced then and were run till they dropped). 

 

I do recall WC showed some early design concepts for Uncharted a year or so back. I think its on the cards as something they would like to do, however "when" is a massive question. 

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As far as I know the 2nd gen UCS stuff are computer designs, so depending on the fabrication method either the masters or the moulds are 3D printed.

Also the Dragon Lords pictured in the last rulebook look more detailed than the earlier models, so I think they actually got reworked, just not to the level of Spartan’s later work.

Anyway, it has been over two years now, I have six fleets gathering dust while waiting to be completed, and I’m not happy about that.

Like I said before, if they don’t have the intention of actually doing something productive with the stuff, then why not sell it on to someone who will do something productive with it.

At the moment the vast majority of the UCS models are still competitive quality wise, and there’s no competition whatsoever, but those circumstances aren’t going to last forever.

They are just burning daylight.

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Has anyone heard anything new on UCS?  I know the COVID-19 pandemic has probably had an influence on things not being done.  Would love to see this come back to life.  Just saw that Kings of War put out Armada.  I would rather support and continue to play UCS than switch to a new format.  I bought into UCS in a BIG way prior to Spartan Games closing it's doors so I have a lot of ships dry docked waiting to set sail.

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The August 12 blog post - https://blog.warcradle.com/blog/2020/warcradle-studios-diary-32 - confirmed that UCS is on the back burner now:
"While some games will have to enter an extended period of ‘Development Hell’ being removed from our current release schedule (Planetfall and Uncharted Seas) and others will see themselves looking at delays into late 2021 and beyond  (Lost World Exodus and Armoured Clash) as we open up space in the schedule to make certain we can support Dystopian Wars and Firestorm Armada in the right way."

The last iteration of the UCS rules (the hardback version) are pretty much solid as is so the best option we have for now is to continue playing those rules knowing there won't be any rules changes, or new models sadly, for at least another year and quite likely longer.

Our club has decided to play UCS regularly as it stands and I have reverted to conversions to fill gaps in the couple of fleets I currently have.

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