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When you mentioned able to use existing models, you also followed up with stating that mobile airfields are gone.  Does that mean that the Brunel, Alamo, and Seydiltz are no longer playable, and to further add the Zhanmadao?  With the change of scale for between naval and armoured, now the Washington land ship and Meztger both have waterlined models, will they be playable any longer in a naval game?

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4 hours ago, hyde1352 said:

When you mentioned able to use existing models, you also followed up with stating that mobile airfields are gone.  Does that mean that the Brunel, Alamo, and Seydiltz are no longer playable, and to further add the Zhanmadao?  With the change of scale for between naval and armoured, now the Washington land ship and Meztger both have waterlined models, will they be playable any longer in a naval game?

The Zhan could still be used in the new scale, as planes aren't physically molded on it. The "new" version would probably just have the troop-drop option for that hangar (the Fushi would still work as infantry in exo-armour).

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Meant more along the lines of Zhan on water.  My groups Chinese player has three, and we rarely play land games, so the loss of an extra large/massive for naval is quite a blow to them.  As well as another FSA player, he tends to play a battleship and two waterlined  Washingtons, mainly due to available units he has.  The question is more for how do those armoured units that are multi-purpose and have a waterlined model, how do those translate into this new version?

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1 hour ago, Warcradle Richard said:

Fracas, it's great to have an opinion, but the decision has been made. It isn't going to be changed.

Seriously Richard, your comments over the last couple of months keep suggesting that you are the least diplomatic of the Warcradle staff. 

 

I know you mean well, but comments like the one above are not necessary. All fans know the scale is changing and that there is nothing we can do or say to keep it at it's currant scale. However, there is no need to write comments that suggests contempt for those that aren't on-board with your point of view or vision for the game. 

 

Like the old saying goes, "if you don't have something nice to say, say nothing at all"

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31 minutes ago, Warcradle Richard said:

There was absolutely no contempt Merlin. Just a  factual statement.  

We can have the forums full of posts questioning decisions already made, that is no problem.  We have been extremely open so far. The same point repeated again and again though is a little pointless.

 

It's the way you say it that makes it read as though you have contempt for those that still disagree with your changes.

 

And so what if some still comment on the same point repeatedly? You've made it clear more than enough times that it's changing. 

 

They have an opinion, let them voice it. It's not going to change anything either way, so why say anything to discourage the talk? It's a general discussion thread afterall. That's what it is for. 

Instead of just saying it's changing and basically telling fans to just get on board or stay quiet, engage and try to get them to see your point of view and why you think it's a good change.

So far, only Stuart is trying to do this. But the information he has shared is limited, either because warcrasle hasn't fully thought everything out or he can't go into too much detail yet.

You, on the other hand, just say what's happening, effectively stating (without actually saying) that fan opinions don't really matter, or at least that's what it comes off like in text.

 

All I'm saying is that you need to choose your words much better. Of all the Warcradle staff that post comments on the forums or facebook, your username is the one i personally least like seeing in the threads. Not because what you say is wrong, but I dislike the way you say it.

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10 hours ago, Warcradle Richard said:

Fracas, it's great to have an opinion, but the decision has been made. It isn't going to be changed.

Unless castings have been made and poured, rules printed i can warn WC against it.

response from the forum was overwhelmingly negative when SG suggested it.  I personally love 8-10 mm war gaming and am a huge fan for planetfall. I just don’t want WC to commit resources to a project that will not be financially rewarding, and risk company wide failure as occurred with SG!

I have seen nothing to suggests the failure of SG DW scaled AC was due to DW scale and that changing scale to 10 mm would make it successful.  Perhaps a poll or some market analysis will provide some objective data apart from one person opinion.

 

again, best wishes to WC success.

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@Fracas, my problem with the scale change is only with the units that used to be able to play land and water.  The new scale for armoured units does make sense in a demented way.  I don't see a medium tank being the size of a high school gym.  I understand the decision has been made, I'd just would like some feedback as to how this might work out.  If Warcradle can clarify on the multi-purpose models, or at the least say it's being looked into at this point, that would help stall most concerns at this juncture.  I hope others share this concern: Not the scale change, but the adjustment of said multi-purpose models in the new version.

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34 minutes ago, hyde1352 said:

@Fracas, my problem with the scale change is only with the units that used to be able to play land and water.  The new scale for armoured units does make sense in a demented way.  I don't see a medium tank being the size of a high school gym.  I understand the decision has been made, I'd just would like some feedback as to how this might work out.  If Warcradle can clarify on the multi-purpose models, or at the least say it's being looked into at this point, that would help stall most concerns at this juncture.  I hope others share this concern: Not the scale change, but the adjustment of said multi-purpose models in the new version.

Perhaps I misunderstood the scale change.  In going to 10mm from 3mm (approximately) will the medium tanks be reclassified as a small thanks despite the details (doors, etc) being 3mm?

my understanding was that the entire range was changing and the current range will only be useable as stand in.

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Might be a translation error between us Fracas, but as I understand it, yes old armoured models can be used as stand-ins.  They just won't look exactly like the new version, just basic framework.  So an access hatch on the old medium model will make the old model look the size of a gymnasium, while the new medium model access hatch makes it look like a regular battle tank.  As for a change to mobile airfields, shame to lose the Alamo.  Was a mighty impressive roadblock.

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Saw those; I thought the comparison was in reference to details rather than scale. The 3mm scaled Minsk was as detailed as shown.  I hope to be wrong. But a side by side comparison with infantry would help.

i have Armor Clash models for 6 factions and am familiar with their size.

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The models are going to be the same size on the tabletop, just the details are increased and magnified.  So the old Minsk and new Minsk will be the same size model, so interchangeable, the details are the difference. 

Any better?

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Concerning me: no ;)

One thing that fascinated me with DW (especially after 2.0) was that you had one set of rules for all theatres, and I could use all my models side by side. Interesting things to me were the above mentioned multi-purpose/surface skimming models, but also the possibility to play scenarios of coastal warfare. With the announcement of New Armoured Clash all my armoured models become obsolete to me. Although I could use some of them with the new set of rules in land games only (without the support of the navy and the fascinating mobile airfields - what a pity), there is no player base here. DW was a niche game here and a few guys maintain(ed) some navies with air support. Reviving DW 3.0 by brushing off the dust of their fleets - could be easily done. Talking them into a new game, needing new models and stop playing this scifi 10mm game of ground warfare - impossible.

 

I don't want to sound like the guy who says: "Everything was better in the old days." The decision has been made and I have to live with it. I'm not happy with it, but I understand, that I live in a rather special situation and my concerns might just concern me. Starting a fan-based project, using SGDW2.5 as a base, with an existing new owner of the IP doesn't also make sense. So for me, DW moved from "Flank Speed" to "Standby". I invest my hobby-time now in other (28mm) projects, my ~13 fleets will stay on the shelf - for the time being.

 

Maybe Warcradle can make me sail again, if they can preserve the feeling of the SG rules. I liked the cumbersome movement of the large ships with the templates. In my imagination it felt suitable and resembled an appropriate simulation of steering such large vessels. Another thing was the number of dice: delivering a broadside by throwing buckets of dice just feels like delivering a broadside. Throwing a D20 for example is faster - for sure - but not the same. The third thing was the tiny possibility, that weird things could happen through luck and Exploding Dice (Because Sturginium!). Take the last remaining frigate and fire her guns on the battleship and through a nearly impossible chain of 6es teleport it on a squad of cruisers... these situations are so epic, I don't even mind losing games through them. And the fourth thing was the versatility of using one set of rules for all theatres of war in one game.

 

So will I have a look at DW3.0? Definitely Yes.

Will I play Armoured Clash? Very unlikely.

I hope Warcradle can make me enjoy Dystopian Wars again - at least I'm longing for it.

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I don't understand the scale change.  I understand it is their right to change it.  I just don't get it.   I currently dont own any armor clash and I am very happy I don't with this scale change coming.   I would like to play it and try Wild West Exodus as well.  My big concern with dystopian age is the three games all having different rules that use completely different core mechanics.   

I really like the idea of playing a campaign or large game that flows from Dystopian wars to Armored clash and then to Wild west exodus.  However, if the three games all use different rules with different core mechanics then I probably won't even bother playing the Armored clash or Wild west exodus.  

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I re-read my post and realized I came off as a copmlete and total jerk.  My apologies that was not my intention.   In the blog post and also on the q and a it was said that the firing arcs for dystopian wars is overly complicated.  They also said they are considering putting bases on the ships.  I do not like the idea of putting bases on the ships.  The forum is a great resource when you have questions or when rules are convoluted.  This may be an issue that can be solved by asking on the forum instead of changing all of the models.  I don't know what part people are having a problem with, but I am willing to try to help explain things.  

War Cradle studios, do you know what questions people have regarding firing arcs in dystopian wars?

Edited by Jsiegel1983
Needed to be reworded.

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Well first of all, the video's volume is far too low. Anyway, nice to hear DW and FSA will return, and I hope you won't make the same mistake as Spartan did and release 50 new games with 88 new factions instead of focussing on the existing stuff. ;) 9Apps/ VidMate & Mobdro

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