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2.5 Orbats Notes

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5 minutes ago, ethicalengineer said:

@Spartan Mike Mike, please, open your ORBATS template and fix EoBS Bomber specialist squadron. Or place sticker on your monitor 'CORRECT NAME OF EoBS heavy bomber in spec squadron'. This is 2-years old mistake. And I don't want to see it again in new ORBATS. Thanks.

The same thing is in the RoF one. They're both from when different names were assigned during their initial testing  (for example, the Raj robo-elephant originally had the working name of "Nelly")

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@ethicalengineer as noted above, I do not have hands on said template. But yes, this and the RoF issue @Nazduruk_Bugzappa Mentioned above are both ones that will be at long last rectified as they are already in my massive list of notes of necessary corrections. Then you won't see them ever again!

numerous Page-One portions across all ORBATS will receive numerous edits and undoubtably improvements as we move forward with our designs and changes. The new Russian Ice Mines are a nod to the evolving nature of each forces national indentity and playstyle. I hope to bring lots of exciting changes into the fold, and that will undoubtably include Specialist Squadrons new and old.

-Mike

 

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I am really looking forward to seeing the changes. certain fleets have received quite a buff with the new rules so there will definitely need to be some movement for the other fleets as well as currently fleets are basically the same as they were before, the FSA is identical in pretty much every way for example (it is French and FSA that I have looked at most closely)

good luck with the changes and we await them excitedly :)

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Now that all models can do re-crewing boarding actions (and thus the Troop Reinforcement MAR has gone) the EotBS Komainu seems rather expensive as it's maintained it's previous cost of 50 and all of its other stats, but its previously special ability can now be done by any model. It really feels like it needs Combat Deployment adding to turn it into a true Garrison Tank.

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Speaking of Prussian toys, The Entropy Generator is rubbish, It has a 50/50 chance of getting a persistent effect which has a 50/50 chance -or more-- of being fixed. It has no impact during the action phase of the entire turn. Meh is being kind. Make it D3 corrosive and maybe you have something that anyone MIGHT pay to take.

HUGE nerf to the Prussians and Italians- Nerfed the Minerva big time. If you thought the Calcification generator was OP fine but THIS is not the answer. The cool description does not come close to what it actually does. It not quite a non-factor but few, no- make that no one- will be changing an action because they are facing this generator.

By the description I expected an immediate disorder check needing two passes (not a huge threat by itself), Chaos and Disarray AND some kind of permanent impact to the hull- or at least generators off line. Imagine the disappointment- This generator can be ignored by the enemy. 

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Okay let's start. My point of view on Americans in this new orbat.

1) Without "3 DR on crit" commodore ability where is unnecessary to nerf Restitution. It is already nerfed, but please, remove hull breacher from Colt-cannons version: it's difficult to damage opponent in close combat with gatling gun! And correct "Marksman" special shooting style: "Shooting and submerged and obscured flyers"? Maybe Models?
2) All massive models has strategic value. They cannot be taken as allies. Is that correct? Anyway all battlecruisers such as Annapolis has strategic value too. Doesn't know is that necessary in 2.5 with new Allies rules;
3) All models that can take huge rocket battery instead of shield gen (Liberty, Independance) should have Barrage (Rockets) like Mississippi Mk-1 or this is useless upgrade;
4) Mississippi Mk1 "This model has Barrage (Rockets) Munitions type must be in MARs, Special Rules section, not Options.
5) Make Lexington 2-4. They are only 10 points cheeper than Georgetown and much more worse than Georgetown;
6) Where is target painter on my Savannah?

 

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30 minutes ago, ethicalengineer said:

Okay let's start. My point of view on Americans in this new orbat.

1) Without "3 DR on crit" commodore ability where is unnecessary to nerf Restitution. It is already nerfed, but please, remove hull breacher from Colt-cannons version: it's difficult to damage opponent in close combat with gatling gun! And correct "Marksman" special shooting style: "Shooting and submerged and obscured flyers"? Maybe Models?
2) All massive models has strategic value. They cannot be taken as allies. Is that correct? Anyway all battlecruisers such as Annapolis has strategic value too. Doesn't know is that necessary in 2.5 with new Allies rules;
3) All models that can take huge rocket battery instead of shield gen (Liberty, Independance) should have Barrage (Rockets) like Mississippi Mk-1 or this is useless upgrade;
4) Mississippi Mk1 "This model has Barrage (Rockets) Munitions type must be in MARs, Special Rules section, not Options.
5) Make Lexington 2-4. They are only 10 points cheeper than Georgetown and much more worse than Georgetown;
6) Where is target painter on my Savannah?

 

Savannah, my personal soapbox. I lost it when I read the new stats. You are paying 15 points for the privilege of losing the option for a Target Painter.

I imagine the logic on the target pointer followed the new rules for TPs, They only work for the platform they are on and any squadron mates. Since the TP on the Savannah was for Primary Gunnery and the Savannah doesn't have any primaries it was useless and dropped. NEVER MIND those hints that some target painters Would be able to target units as they used to before the change. Also ignore the evident applicability of a TP to that platform. Its a natural. Perhaps it will be included for free in the clean up of 2.5 Orbats. 

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7 minutes ago, CDR_G said:

NEVER MIND those hints that some target painters Would be able to target units as they used to before the change

As a CoA player, whose options for putting serious damage on anything large are either drones or TP combo, disappointed is an understatement.

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@Danger Frog Agreed. Part of the larger review that is coming. Especially for the much maligned armoires elements of the games!

@varnoshardly intentional. Error sadly.

@ethicalengineer thanks for the laundry list. A lot of thise issues mirror concerns I have already penned for review. 

@Thread:

The concerns generated from issues like that mentioned with the target painters/entropy generators, are both relevant and well warranted. These are just the issues that will be resolved as we integrate a larger team and go over each ORBAT and resovle as we do our balance review... and more importantly, have be proper time to integrate the superior Page-One ORBAT documents that I have been planning for each nation.

-Mike

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I included typos I saw in the other thread already, but off the top of my head a vessel needs a comma between Small Target and the following MAR (think it was Augusta) and the Miss. MK1 has the Volley Gun listed inconsistently, as both Heavy Volley Gun and as Fore Volley Gun, but only one of those has stats. 

 

The Mk1 also lost some Rocket firepower, but I guess that was intentional. :-(

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Okay, i'll continue with EoBS:

1) Sokotsu isn't massive. No way;
2) Give my Hachiman mines. He have mines on the rear of model :P
3) Mizuchi. Same problem as annapolis - 25 strategic value;
4) Arashi. Too expensive;
5) Zarigani nerfed too much, but this is good improvement for Raigin;
6) Suzaku. Correct him in special squadron.

I don't completely agree with TP rework and node projector nerf. TP must be as in 2.0 but work in command consolidation and node launcher was normal. Nowadays I will not take models with such generators at all.

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8 hours ago, Danger Frog said:

Now that all models can do re-crewing boarding actions (and thus the Troop Reinforcement MAR has gone) the EotBS Komainu seems rather expensive as it's maintained it's previous cost of 50 and all of its other stats, but its previously special ability can now be done by any model. It really feels like it needs Combat Deployment adding to turn it into a true Garrison Tank.

It's not even that - the re-crew action may only be taken by models within the same squadron.

So, two big losers that come to mind are the Indian Raj Jhasa carrier, and the Operational Assets Titan Troop Transport - both are "Squadron Size 1" models :-(

Unless there's going to be a bespoke MAR for factions with models such as those. But i think that'sonly going to happen with certain Generators.

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Compilation of errors I've found so far for EoBS

Tenkei - Rocket Turret (t) One Rocket Battery (t) has 360

Migea - used to be Miagea

Line Infantry - is now a small fortification ?!

Close Infantry - has not ARC of fire

Recon Infanry - Spotter (Regular, 16")

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On 06/21/2017 at 7:52 AM, CDR_G said:

HUGE nerf to the Prussians and Italians- Nerfed the Minerva big time.

I only recently acquired the Italians with the Corsican Incident so I hadn't previously accessed their stats.  What was the nerf on the Minerva?  Is it the change of the Generator rules or was it a statistical change before this?

If the latter, what were the pre-nerf stats?

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4 hours ago, Drastab said:

I only recently acquired the Italians with the Corsican Incident so I hadn't previously accessed their stats.  What was the nerf on the Minerva?  Is it the change of the Generator rules or was it a statistical change before this?

If the latter, what were the pre-nerf stats?

The Calcification Generator was an internal part of LoIS tactics. The entropy is at best an also ran.

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54 minutes ago, CDR_G said:

The Calcification Generator was an internal part of LoIS tactics. The entropy is at best an also ran.

I See your point, 66%  chance of removing enemy point defenses and maybe AP.  And it takes effect now

Versus a 50% chance of placing a marker that is only 50% likely (25% in total) to cause a single point of hull damage.

I am hoping that the talk of nation rules for different generators applies in this case... Or the Italians get something completely new and effective.

Then again maybe the Italians are too busy riding their mopeds to care, Ciao.

 

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