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Wolfchild

1000pt struggles pls help

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Ok, I have a 1000pt list that's finally managed to pull off a win vs Russians, but since lost to RoF, FSA, Russians again. Previous list not doing the trick either.

Since last Orbat changes I've just struggled to get results. Biggest struggle w this fleet is low activation count, but at least it has access to big enough dice pools to penetrate armour.

Aristotle w energy + Kepler attached

3 x Cleomedes primary

Hyperbius

3 x Ptolemy

3 x Plutarch

SAS 5 fighter, 5 fighters, 5 fighters (relaunch as bombers after enemy bomber threat resolved)

(Local meta has at least 1 if not a couple carriers per fleet currently)

 

Models available:

Diophantus, Pericles, Aristotle, Arronax

2 Kepler, Hippasus, 2 Hyperbius, 3 Capek, 3 Ptolemy, 3 Cleomedes, 4 Fresnel

3 Plutarch, 4 Diophantus, 10 Thales

(enough SAW to cover all options)

 

Please offer suggestions and reasoning / suggestions how to use it. I'm trying not to sound defeatist.

At v2.0 I was doing really well and not relying on drone spam to win either, in fact rarely even using any carriers.

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In 1000pts, looking at the ships you have available, the list I would use is:

Aristotle (primary turrets)

Pericles (energy turrets)

3× Cleomedes (primary turrets)

2× Fresnel

5× Thales

5× Thales

(995pts)

Start all drones as fighters, and clear the sky of potential threats. Pick a "prime target" for each squadron, and concentrate on it (only target other things if you have a spare weapon without arc to that target). The Fresnels actually make a good anti-air squadron during the early stages of the game (use that potential 16AD well).

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9 hours ago, Wolfchild said:

Can I ask why primaries on the Aristotle? They don't add up to much and lose firepower very fast..... Just to save 20pt so it fits?

I may try it next outing tho.

I usually divide my fleet into "tag teams" with some acting as distractions for others, and drawing fire away.

Eg: If the Aristotle is getting shot at,  the Fresnels and Cleos are not getting shot. 

The Aristotle and Cleomedes squad also provide "cover" for the corvette squads to prize targets

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My enemies surprisingly don't focus fire that much, so with FSA mediums n Larges especially I'm lifting models all over the place. Tag teams should make sense, but not in real game terms here.

Also, Fresnels n Cleos are so soft that they're easy targets, esp Fresnels. They seem to sink so easy and are prime targets w their 16dice pool.

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Cleos, when wavelurked, are possibly the toughest cruisers in the game. Now that doesn't mean they are particularly hard to destroy, and when wavelurked they lose significant firepower, but still...

Fresnels are tough buggers too. CR 7, backed up with an inventive shield and the ability to be 100% effective at extreme range. If your Fresnels are any closer than rb4 then something has gone wrong with your plan for them. If they are at rb4 then it should be difficult for the enemy to get a sufficiently high dice pool to deal with cr7 and the shield (except for FSA). 2 corvettes stand a fair chance of prizing one, but having them shot to death shouldn't happen too easily. DR 4 is not too hard to beat, but their weapons don't really care about a bit of damage here or there. If your opponent is blasting at a Fresnel then the chances are that they are not shooting something more fragile.

I would steer well clear of a primary turret Aristotle. I like the Aristotle, but it is a gift wrapped prize for any opponent unless it has e-turrets and can stay away from the enemy. The french battlecruiser is harder to board than the Aristotle. Distance is your only reliable defence. Primary turrets need to be close to be effective, and are neigh on useless after 3 points of damage.

The Pericles is another one I cannot recommend, despite quite liking it. It is not a bad ship for its role, it is a decent drone launcher and has ok firepower. It is very very squishy though, which is a major flaw when it has such a high points cost and a ludicrous strategic value. When dead, this thing gives away nearly 300 points. DR 5 CR 8 HP8.

But here is my problem... I am not really sure I can recommend anything. 1k points is a small match in which to build some synergy between specialsts. Ptolemys are excellent mine layers, if you are finding success with them then keep them, but 1k might be a bit too small to spend points on them. Plutarchs are... well, they are okish. Expensive again though.

However... we are the CoA, and we can use trickery where we might struggle with more mundane solutions. Enemy brought carriers aplenty? They are generally valuable prizes or derelicts if our boarding units can get to them. Activation advantage being against us, that could be difficult. So lets bend the rules! Bring your hippasus and 2 waves of 5 corvettes. Advance deploy the corvettes and the Hippasus behind some nice cover and in turn one, teleportal them towards a sufficiently juicy target (carriers being a favourite) and rip the heart from the enemy fleet. You will lose both corvette squadrons over the turn, and the Hippasus will be considerably less useful, but it can be a devastating early blow. Unreliable though, quite luck based, but either way your opponent will feel the pressure.

We also need a large vessel, and the only one that even vaguely fits in a 1k list is an Aristotle with energy turrets. 15 dice of linked up energy fire will put a dent in anything. Attaching the Kepler can be tempting (and against dreadnoughts is one of our few ways of generating dread-killing firepower) but at 1k I would keep them seperate for more activations and flexibility of positioning. A kepler is safer up close the enemy than an Aristotle is, and can launch drones ready for immediate use the next turn.

Lastly, something to hold the line and provide some flexible options. Cleomedes. Lets have a squadron of them too, their firepower can help the Aristotle kill things and their crew can make a boarding attempt when necessary.

So:

1 Aristotle with e-turrets

3 Cleomedes

2 Kepler

1 Hippasus

5 Thales

5 Thales

Usual CoA tactics: kill the enemy boarders, use nasty trick to hurt the enemy.

A quick and easy alteration is to swap out the Hippasus for a Hyperbius, equip e-turrets to the Cleomedes and play the long-range-energy-game.

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On 11 July 2016 at 1:43 AM, Texas_Archer said:

I would recommend using a squad of repair ships to go with your fleet.  15 repair AP for only 90 points is a very potent way of keeping your ships in the fight.

When did we get access to repair ships? I've only ever seen the Russian ones.

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On 10 July 2016 at 4:23 PM, Thamoz said:

Cleos, when wavelurked, are possibly the toughest cruisers in the game. Now that doesn't mean they are particularly hard to destroy, and when wavelurked they lose significant firepower, but still...

Fresnels are tough buggers too. CR 7, backed up with an inventive shield and the ability to be 100% effective at extreme range. If your Fresnels are any closer than rb4 then something has gone wrong with your plan for them. If they are at rb4 then it should be difficult for the enemy to get a sufficiently high dice pool to deal with cr7 and the shield (except for FSA). 2 corvettes stand a fair chance of prizing one, but having them shot to death shouldn't happen too easily. DR 4 is not too hard to beat, but their weapons don't really care about a bit of damage here or there. If your opponent is blasting at a Fresnel then the chances are that they are not shooting something more fragile.

I would steer well clear of a primary turret Aristotle. I like the Aristotle, but it is a gift wrapped prize for any opponent unless it has e-turrets and can stay away from the enemy. The french battlecruiser is harder to board than the Aristotle. Distance is your only reliable defence. Primary turrets need to be close to be effective, and are neigh on useless after 3 points of damage.

The Pericles is another one I cannot recommend, despite quite liking it. It is not a bad ship for its role, it is a decent drone launcher and has ok firepower. It is very very squishy though, which is a major flaw when it has such a high points cost and a ludicrous strategic value. When dead, this thing gives away nearly 300 points. DR 5 CR 8 HP8.

But here is my problem... I am not really sure I can recommend anything. 1k points is a small match in which to build some synergy between specialsts. Ptolemys are excellent mine layers, if you are finding success with them then keep them, but 1k might be a bit too small to spend points on them. Plutarchs are... well, they are okish. Expensive again though.

However... we are the CoA, and we can use trickery where we might struggle with more mundane solutions. Enemy brought carriers aplenty? They are generally valuable prizes or derelicts if our boarding units can get to them. Activation advantage being against us, that could be difficult. So lets bend the rules! Bring your hippasus and 2 waves of 5 corvettes. Advance deploy the corvettes and the Hippasus behind some nice cover and in turn one, teleportal them towards a sufficiently juicy target (carriers being a favourite) and rip the heart from the enemy fleet. You will lose both corvette squadrons over the turn, and the Hippasus will be considerably less useful, but it can be a devastating early blow. Unreliable though, quite luck based, but either way your opponent will feel the pressure.

We also need a large vessel, and the only one that even vaguely fits in a 1k list is an Aristotle with energy turrets. 15 dice of linked up energy fire will put a dent in anything. Attaching the Kepler can be tempting (and against dreadnoughts is one of our few ways of generating dread-killing firepower) but at 1k I would keep them seperate for more activations and flexibility of positioning. A kepler is safer up close the enemy than an Aristotle is, and can launch drones ready for immediate use the next turn.

Lastly, something to hold the line and provide some flexible options. Cleomedes. Lets have a squadron of them too, their firepower can help the Aristotle kill things and their crew can make a boarding attempt when necessary.

So:

1 Aristotle with e-turrets

3 Cleomedes

2 Kepler

1 Hippasus

5 Thales

5 Thales

Usual CoA tactics: kill the enemy boarders, use nasty trick to hurt the enemy.

A quick and easy alteration is to swap out the Hippasus for a Hyperbius, equip e-turrets to the Cleomedes and play the long-range-energy-game.

Thanks Thamoz. I may give this a go next time.

Would u use 1st squadron thru the portal to shoot and 2nd to board or just attempt 5x2 boarders with each?

I've not had much luck w corvettes in the past, so I'm not keeping hopes too high, (but my default is negativity, so don't take it personally)

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3 minutes ago, Veldrain said:

The merchant cruisers out of Operational Assets.  Any force can take them.

Too much of a purist I'm afraid. I only end up with 'allies' in multiplayer games, no matter what system I'm playing.

U know, the kinda OCD that gets u killed

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On 7/13/2016 at 1:56 PM, Wolfchild said:

Too much of a purist I'm afraid. I only end up with 'allies' in multiplayer games, no matter what system I'm playing.

U know, the kinda OCD that gets u killed

Thats the beauty of them though, they are not Allies.  These are mostly non-combatent ships and oil derricks that all nation have and use.  Yes, they will come out of your non core force, but you don't need to have the 1 capitol/1 non capitol squadron requirement.  The operational assets allow each nation to have the following as well as their warships:  A troop transport capable of boarding targets from 8" out, but only hit on 6's.  They allow Escort Carriers, although they don't work with COA so good.  You get access to a modular medium that can be anything from a merchant ship to an Armed Merchantmen, to afull on Q-ship that has 2 turrets and Torps and a squad of 2-4, and the Repair ships.  You also get access to mini escorts that can escort in squads of up to 4,.  Finally, you get oil derricks that can be there for a scenerio,. or armed to the teeth with guns and torpedos.  They are very fun to use and add a little wrinkle into pure nation play...

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On Saturday, July 16, 2016 at 2:01 AM, Texas_Archer said:

Thats the beauty of them though, they are not Allies.  These are mostly non-combatent ships and oil derricks that all nation have and use.  Yes, they will come out of your non core force, but you don't need to have the 1 capitol/1 non capitol squadron requirement.  The operational assets allow each nation to have the following as well as their warships:  A troop transport capable of boarding targets from 8" out, but only hit on 6's.  They allow Escort Carriers, although they don't work with COA so good.  You get access to a modular medium that can be anything from a merchant ship to an Armed Merchantmen, to afull on Q-ship that has 2 turrets and Torps and a squad of 2-4, and the Repair ships.  You also get access to mini escorts that can escort in squads of up to 4,.  Finally, you get oil derricks that can be there for a scenerio,. or armed to the teeth with guns and torpedos.  They are very fun to use and add a little wrinkle into pure nation play...

Thank for that Texas I didn't know that. When I play at my local club one of the FSA players has a flying repair ship.

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5 hours ago, Hrafn said:

Thank for that Texas I didn't know that. When I play at my local club one of the FSA players has a flying repair ship.

With a squad of 3 repair ships, you basically can repair any ship in the game for 90 points.  A squad of 2 at 60 points works well at repairing mediums and lighter larges.  Trust me here, these little babies have won me tournaments, by keeping my ships in top form.

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