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azrael

ULTIMATE 1OOO point lists

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As the other race I own is terrans I thought I would post this challenge on here as well (aquans being the other).

Give me your ultimate 1000 points lists to take on all comers in any scenario. Make it as nasty as you can !

A small brief on why you selected each squadron would be awesome

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And now I ask myself the question: is this what it has come to? Is this all tabletop wargaming is? Throwing down the nastiest list you can imagine to drive your enemies before you and hear the lamentations of their waifus? 

 

Whatever happened to just picking a thousand points of stuff, putting it on the table and seeing what happens, regardless of points efficiency or how it'd do in a tournament? Is it not enough to play the game for gits and shiggles, to have a laugh at some absurdly unlikely occurrence and if you win, well done? 

 

I must be getting old... 

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More for the aquans than the terrans I must admit but I was wondering what people would put down, if any squads made it in all lists especially with some people's take on the latest reinforcements.

My usual list is "what have I not used in a long time" and whack them all together in a list trimming to the selected points.

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Whatever happened to just picking a thousand points of stuff, putting it on the table and seeing what happens, regardless of points efficiency or how it'd do in a tournament? Is it not enough to play the game for gits and shiggles, to have a laugh at some absurdly unlikely occurrence and if you win, well done?

When has anyone ever played that way? That could be fun once, maybe, but not regularly... Unless you have a very balanced game.

Firestorm Armada, and wargaming in general, is by definition a competition of skill between players through game mechanics. It sounds like you approach games as an activity, not a contest.

While you can play a game as a fun activity, you shouldn't lament when people use it as a contest.

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The issue of competitive VS casual is always a nightmare in any hobby that has even a modest amount of competitive elements. It mostly comes down to individual skill sets and the fact that in any group you get good and bad players. Highly competitive groups tend to push out the less skilled [much as you can love playing always losing is - well - boring] or at least those unwilling/able to learn better. 

 

At least in smaller groups this is the case - much larger groups tend to have a more even spread and thus people tend to settle a bit more easily into a group that meets their skill level. 

 

 

However it also tends to be more of an issue in unblanced games that allow silly lists of extreme over-powered nature. GW is a prime example where there are many lists that are mechanically pretty dull but are outstandingly powerful. As a result min/maxing on units or just spamming the powerful stuff can build really deadly armies that are very hard to counter. It creates an additional level as you're normally abandoning balanced army building and just going for the spam. 

 

 

 

 

Most other game systems don't have systems quite that casually bad 

 

 

 

But yes at the core building a good army is part of the games skill; just as playing it is. 

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List building is half the game for me. Its a skill i developed back when i was playing 40k and i had to make my fluffy list somewhat competitive. It sorta carried over to FSA and now i constantly build, optimize and reject new list. Trying to build around certain themes and missions. The only difference is this time there is no fluff handicap  ;)

That leads to my next point. I cant imagine any "nasty OP take all comers list" off the top off my head that wouldn't be beaten by a list designed for the specific mission that was played. There simply is no easy "i win" button to spam like in 40k (riptides, knigths etc..). I believe this is one of the reasons that this forum isnt just endless netlisting. Balancing around known opponents and missions was the right choice.

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When has anyone ever played that way? That could be fun once, maybe, but not regularly... Unless you have a very balanced game.

Firestorm Armada, and wargaming in general, is by definition a competition of skill between players through game mechanics. It sounds like you approach games as an activity, not a contest.

While you can play a game as a fun activity, you shouldn't lament when people use it as a contest.

Wargaming only got competitive when people started up tournaments for it. Until that point, it was a social activity. Nowadays though, it just seems to be a rush to the net-lists, aside from historicals, who are too busy counting buttons to bother with that ****. In my area, unless you are curbstomping noobs with 5 Imperial Knights or some ridiculous bull****, or playing X-Wing, you tend not to get a game. That sort of environment and group-think is driving me out of this hobby. So I can damn well lament it all I like! 

 

Thankfully for my sanity, and in game balance, the list building rules in Firestorm are actually worth a more than the file space it takes up on the PDF (GW, take note, you may learn something from the folks at Spartan, like how to make a proper game). This means that truly nasty lists are an impossibility. Yes, there are some lists that are more powerful than others, but none are almighty and invulnerable. And I am grateful for this. 

 

This will be my last post on any gods-damned forum for a while, so farewell, so long and thanks for all the fish. 

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Local groups/player's gameplay style will probably end up effecting what one takes in a fleet build. Less scenery or more 'blobular' scenery setups when happening on a regular basis I should also imagine will hone fleet builds. There's not much that can't be countered with some good use of tactics and a balanced fleet approach. Combined with some varied missions you have a pretty good system for players to customise fleets but without it breaking the game. I just got my behind handed to me by the 'Drenze when playing Terrans. I lost by less of a margin by thinking as if it were a campaign mission, and therefore important to preserve prime fleet assets. Some of the fleet withdrew from Battle rather than fighting till the bitter end. But that's just a bit of spice I like to put into games..

No I lost because my opponent used his fleet well and I made some errors!. So there'll be a next game when I will have learnt some lessons!

Would I change the fleet build? Possibly, however it was the errors I made with my smalls that scuppered my offensive output. Not necessarily choice of T1s and 2s.

Would there have been a better combination to play those 'Drenze with?. Oh quite possibly but then another mission may have changed things as well. Those are factors in who's going to be the victor in any one game.

So uber list building in this game, does it exist? I'd say no. Does slightly bad non synergistic list building exist? I'd say yes lol.

Will having minimal smalls and max T1s win you a game by default. Will it *******s! If you were to play against a non synergistic list then you'll have an easier time. So many mistakes to make in game it really does seem to come down to, who's used their forces better. So +1 for Firestorm Armada

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Ooh forgot to mention. If you play with a non synergistic list then what's different in this is you'll still have a good game. Plus it will be possible to win or draw based on skill and a bit of luck. There's just not the same feel in this as there is in that other game. Ships don't automatically dissapear on turn 1. Well done might but it'll be down to putting enough fire on them or a lucky crit.

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Nastiest list I could think of on a moment's notice:

 

Tyrant - 170 - 195
+3 Wings- free
Shield Projector (Self) - 10
3 Interceptors - 15
 
2x Marshall - 260
 
3x Horizon Assault Cruiser - 105 - 120
+3 AP, remove Planetfall - 15
 
3x Turale Torpedo Cruisers - 180
 
6x Wayfarer - 120
 
6x Wayfarer - 120
 
 
Marshalls and Turales should be a bit obvious- they can hang back and throw stupid numbers of torpedoes, and then both have relatively nasty weapons should anything get close. With side weapons, they can just kind of move across the table laterally, as well, rather than needing to advance, which can baffle enemy plans depending of how fast their fleet is. The kicker is combining this with the Tyrant, which can babysit them with 'Ceptors for a while, but is also, y'know, a Tyrant. 3 Shields with Projector (self) is tough to crack, even with the average 6-10 Dr/Cr. In theory, you're setting up a choice- waste fire on the Tyrant, which isn't really a ship you're relying on for firepower but can dominate late game if you let it, or advance on the Torpedo hurlers working the backline.
 
Horizons tend to be unsubtle, but they do have a subtle use here, namely buckets of PD- should you encounter a fleet with good Interceptor coverage, they'll still be inclined to move forward to combat your Torpedo boats and eventually they'll have to deal with your Horizons pouring Point Defence into their SRS. At that point, the AP is just a bonus, what they're there to do is make sure SRS can't shut your other ships down. This is actually part of the mentality that leads to the Wayfarers over other T3s. On one hand, they can take potshots from pretty dang far away if you aren't worrying about Interceptors. 6 AD out to 40" is pretty nuts, BUT should your foe be bringing Interceptors, and because all the Terran T3s have 1 PD, the larger squad size brings more PD to shoot at their SRS. You could shunt them in to try and take their 'Ceptors down a notch.

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