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Spellduckwrong

Poll For Adepticon Points Level

What Points Level Would You Prefer for a Four Round Adepticon Tournament?  

43 members have voted

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I've played quite a few 600 point games and they more often center around a battlecruiser, carrier, or heavy cruiser squadron.

A lot of the people in our area like to think of themselves as "the different" guys. There's sort of a competition going about who is the least competitive :D

Because of this we see a lot of people try new ideas and field off the wall thematic lists. But without fail 800 and 900 point games end up looking very similar.

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We play 1000 points in my LGS as the standard for practice and tournaments. I think its a great point level that allows everything to be fielded. People play fleets centered around dreadnoughts or they play cruiser heavy, I personally run a double battleship list. I think 800 points is too small and can discourage lists that focus on expensive center pieces by not allowing ample room for support. 1000, is a small step up in play time from 800, but allows a great leap in list diversity. 

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What group is the Poll in on FB?  Just curious as im in a few different FSA groups and i havent seen it.

 

Having listened to the Jaded Gamercast a few times, i think they have valuable input but the earlier comment about them having a distinct meta (largly shaped by their pre-formed opinions) rings true.  As well, (from listening) I dont find that their tactical or list advice is built on the soundest understanding of the rules of the game sometimes.

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First of all, thanks for making a poll.

 

I found the 900 points level to be quite balanced.  There was no unbeatable dreadnought scourge, no spammy frigate swarm, or anything to make 900 pt unfair.  The thing was, I found 900 a little awkward to build.  I experimented with two or three factions and just felt like either I had points to spare or not quite enough to get 5 full squads. 

 

At 1000 points I'm excited to play, because I feel like I have room for one Tier 1, 2x Tier 2, and 2x Tier 3 in just about any faction I choose.  I do feel like you'll see dreadnoughts more at this level.  Dreads aren't the massive rocks they're feared to be, and in missions that require mobility or multiple objectives they are disadvantaged.

 

All my games at Adepticon 2015 at 900pt came to a "natural conclusion" and were not called short on time.   1000pt being just 100 points more that's only 3-4 more frigates on the board per player, or a cruiser or two, so my hope is that the time per game is similar.

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What exactly is a "natural conclusion"?

My biggest concern for an event is to afford everyone enough time to play the game. Some factions, if played well, won't really be hitting their stride until turns 4 or 5... Which means they probably need to reach Turn 6 when they win.

How many Turns did each game have? How often did players not reach a full game end, where the game was not impacted by the time limit?

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I call a "natural conclusion" as a game that ends for any reason other than the referee saying "dice down, stop playing, time is up".  Two of my games ended on either turn 5 or 6, because no ships were left for the opponent, and the other two games on turn 6 by a roll of 1-3 to see if the game ends.

 

I hear that other people had to stop playing on turn 3 or 4 due to "time's up" but this wasn't my experience, and "time's up" situations seemed to be the minority, just from my anecdotal experience.

 

SpellDuck says that 800 point games at their store and tournaments are actually slower than 900 point games according to their record keeping.  He and his crew did a damn fine job of running the Adepticon tournament, so I'm inclined to trust their recordkeeping. 

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Thanks for clarifying; I was concerned all your games were ending because you obliterated your opponent, and/or he ran away. I'm glad you made it to Turn 6 in two games. Do you think those could have gone to Turn 9?

Thinking about it, one of the issues is how a game of Firestorm Armada will end by the rules:

1) Number of Turns played

2) One side completely removed (destroyed/escaped)

2.5) One side forced to Emergency Shunt Escape (lose, which I have never heard of happening)

3) Two Scenarios (from all 10) include "Victory Conditions" which can end the game (but neither directly translate to "victory")

I think that's it. There is no way to "win" a game of Firestorm; you either don't lose, one player withdraws, or have more Battlelog than your opponent when the last Turn is played. Maybe the solution is to incorporate "win" mechanisms, and more likely "lose" mechanisms?

I think Planetfall has the opposite approach: there is one "win" mechanism, and that's it. I'm not even sure if you technically lose if wiped out, but it does end the game.

I am not doubting their record-keeping at all, as it makes sense that 900 points would play faster. Those extra points will generally translate into more firepower for the same number of activations and same number of models... but how often would people play a 900 point game if they had not tried a 900 point Tournament in the first place? Every other 900 Point Event I am aware of was built specifically in reaction to Adepticon's 900 points.

Almost everything else is at multiples of 200.

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If you want a "win" mechanic (albeit I would be hesitant about going so far as to change how the game is played just for the sake of one tournament especially a big one where the lowest common denominator of deviation from the actual rulebook is best) I would look to how Halo handles it.  
Last thing you do in the end step is see who has more points, if you reacht he maximum points for your game size then the game ends and you determine margine of victory.

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If you want a "win" mechanic (albeit I would be hesitant about going so far as to change how the game is played just for the sake of one tournament especially a big one where the lowest common denominator of deviation from the actual rulebook is best) I would look to how Halo handles it.

Last thing you do in the end step is see who has more points, if you reacht he maximum points for your game size then the game ends and you determine margine of victory.

I was just thinking the same thing. It would basically be the equivalent of triggering an Emergency Shunt just on the other side of the scale. It seems like it would definitely speed up the scenarios with Tactical objectives that generate BL but not necessarily assure an auto-win.

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I was surprised how fast a game can go when it's two people who play the game a lot and know the rules and their ships.  Playing against experienced players was really the joy of Adepticon for me.  Neither of my games that ended by 1,2,3 dice roll on turn 6 likely would have gone to turn 9.  Regardless the outcome of all of my games was pretty clear by turn 5. 

 

An 'win' mechanic that involves achieving the top end of the BL scale is an interesting idea, but would surely require extensive playtesting and is out of the scope of Adepticon planning.

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I've never tried 1000 point battles, but 900 was a good level last year. It seemed to nicely accommodate the mandatory 1 large, 1 medium, and 2 small with enough points left over for one more good squadron. That led to a lot of variety in the lists, it seemed to me. Extra cruiser squadron, swarms of frigates, carrier support, all kinds of possiblities. 1000 might be similar, but I worry about the ability to get the games finished in a reasonable time. Next time I have my druthers, I'll try 1000 and see what it feels like. 

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