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Kryptik

New era of CoA, a noob perspective

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So, from what I see having not yet played the new Orbat, I already find the CoA has changed dramatically. I intend to chronical my findings here, so I will start from scratch and post my thoughts in their entirety here before playing. This way interested parties can follow this noobs transition into a different and altogether uncertain new world with the CoA.

 

The previous itteration of our beloved penguins saw that we had no real answers to the big toys from other nations, instead relying on our sas to soften them up or, for those so inclined, board the **** out of them with zenos. All that has changed! And I couldn't be more excited. Lets take a look see.

 

Keep in mind my group only plays 1250, so dreads don't make much of an appearance at all. So the diophantus and prometheus won't see much table time for me.

 

OK, here we go. Change number 1 for me is that, with the changes to the diophantus, the periclese will be seeing lots and lots of table time. At 170 points the thing is a steal. I know I know, people already are fielding it and feel it is terrible. 5/8 is meh. But the thing is meant to hide like a coward and I think will shine in late game when the Kepotle squadron (more on that later) has already done the heavy lifting. And with the aristotle now relegated to it's own squadron, is the best satisfier of the large squadron requirement in my mind. The diophantus can perform this roll, but for the point investment it eats into other potential activations. Now this doesn't change our play style much, but is worth mentioning. It gets the number 1 change for me because it impacts our admiral placement greatly.

 

What does impact our play style is the drone changes, so onto big change number 2 for me. Drones have been double nerf bat whacked. 12" across the board gives us access to the slowest moving hunks of rubbish ever to fly the skies in terms of SAS. Their threat range is crud now and I feel their role is now reactive instead of proactive, especially given the changes to relaunches. I'll be using mostly fighter and some torp bombers to start for the increased threat range, while dive bombers will be late game clean up with what's left in my reserve. CAP will be huge now on ships that can have it. Drones are now almost a pure defensive force, which makes sense even if I don't like it.

 

Big change 3, the keppler aristotle squardon I shall henceforth refer to as Kepotles. Why would you never take this option? 18 AD at all range bands now lets us whittle down the large threats from relative safety. It is pricey at 395 points, but to have the option for large ship punishment reaching out 48" is a thing I had only dreamed of. Finally, we have our large beater that was sorely missing before. This type of unit makes our forces race against the clock to kill the nasties before they close, but it is the best option we've had for it to date. Throw in redoubtable and I'm sure this squadron configuration will get nerfed like our drones will so live it up while you can.  

 

Big change 4 is broad. Now every vessel that made our awesome drones more awesome have reduced effectiveness by proxy. This means there are certain ships that are not as worth it as before (Hippasus, I'm referring DIRECTLY to you). Hyperbius still has her glorious uses (target painter;energy) to help kepotles dole out serious punishment. I'll take two please, and thank you. But we find ourselves with points to spend in other places than making our drones extra super awesome.

 

Big change 5 is the aerial force nerf. Forced to take a large (when playing aerial core), of which both are trash, is a painful pill to swallow. The daedalus has inexplicably passed up the euclid in terms of usefulness not because of a buff to it, but because of the nastiest nerfing in our entire Orbat. And is now also better than the epicurus because of an indirect nerf to drones. Astounding. So we have no quality large flier. OK, but now that capeks got trodden on and middling small option it will be very hard to make a solid aerial force that is not relying heavily on either sea or ground choices to cover serious faults. Just too bad. By the by, ptolomies may have gotten better not because of the stats (which actually nerfed them being more expensive) but now have access to a specialized squadron that is probably the best we have available. Ptolemies and the hyperbius are the best aerial models we have as the rest of the choices drip eye liner into pools of their own blood while cutting themselves. Yes, mean our airforce went almost pure emo. 

 

As for medium changes, the zenos somehow increased in value relative to what happened everywhere else. Diogenes squadrons lost a little of their umph but at least give points back. Galens are now an actual option, finally. Cleos still feel underwhelming. And Fresnels remain steadfast and get an extra link die per ship out of the deal. So, how do I plan to change my lists seeing these changes? I'm nearly positive you don't care, but I'll post my next list for all to see and tear asunder!

 

Periclese (admiral)

Kepotle max

Platos max

Hyperbius

Hyperbius

Diogenes max

Thales max

Thales 4

 

It continues to have the medium and small killing potential that was never a problem for our forces (in the way of hyperbius, platos, periclese, and diogenese foremost) while one hyperbius assists where needed in the back field and the other targets a large for the kepotles to barrage. It is also with the added bonus of 14 activations all together. Drones now purely milk activations and defend my ships. One hyperbius, the platos and the thales squadrons take forward positions in deployment while the rest sit back, crack open a brewski, and dole out death covered by their sas friends in the sky. Some of those sas (numbering squads of 5/5/5/5/5/4) will be torp bombers to help whittle out the smalls that make it through or support the forward squadrons. Likely I'll split 5/5/4 in fighters and 5/5/5 in torp bombers. After they thin out, I'll begin launching dive bombers to take out already crippled targets. I could end up going all in on torp bombers or very close to it depending on what the enemy brings in regards to carries and aerial models however. But the flexibility remains a nice option.

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Aristotle-Kepler squadron is 300 points, and range is 32", not 48".

 

I'm finding a lot of my list building now revolves around making sure I have enough of each size class, because I struggle to find space for all the mediums I want to take. Aristotle-Kepler squadron is a very expensive squadron that does the same thing that DNs do- the game does rather revolve around it in smaller games. We now have a single naval large choice worth taking, but only if you're playing an E-turret list. Our other options are DNs, or the Pericles- which I've never really liked, to be honest.

 

The Epicurus keeps getting nerfed, and it doesn't need it. Especially with the new drone rules, it should have been buffed further. Increased points, points for E-turrets, no extended launch range, still low HP for a sky fortress... the list goes on, and it's really disappointing.

 

EDIT: Oh, and the Euclid is total **** now. I thought that should be added just to keep it in mind.

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Agreed on aerial. So much sigh. But with kepotles, 185+20+95+95 is legal right? But i was incorrect, that set up is 21ad. At 32 inches. 48 was a brain fart lol

Edit:i did address the aerial forces in change 5,which is where we are completely on agreeance. Poor Euclid.

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Ack. Ty for clarifying. My noob brain thought that meant 1 aristotle could attach. Derp, but that brings up a question. Does an aristotle with kepler satisfy the the large requirement? Or, by adding the kepler, does it not count as the minimum 1 large anymore?

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Ah! Thank you seb and starnite! So, the comparison begins...

 

Prometheus: 24/20/16/12 firing to the side to max the large turrets, adding in a seperate 12/10/8/4 broadsides. So, if fully healthy, the will get hits of 12+9/14.75+5/11.5+4/9+2 on a roughly average base. Not bad. Add in that you can shoot in other guns forward too, it has some flexibility.

 

Kepotles: 18/18/18/18 redoubtable, giving consistent hits of 13.5/13.5/13.5/13.5.

 

Diophantus: total wet noodle at 15/13/10/7 shots equating to roughly 11.25/9.33/6.75/4.75 hits.

 

The math is very crude, but suitable I think. Now, the dio obviously pales in firepower in a single arc. It has torps and a great PA to the front, but you can't use both systems on the same target. It is a medium and small nightmare but of little consequence to larger ships. The Prometheus has greater flexibility with it's firepower, so can do more damage in a spread amongst different ships. But the kepotle, in my mind, reigns supreme as a single target destroyer. It is now averaging a crit on just about any large and most dreads from 32" away. And now, with my thinking that drones are reactive and thus not needed in such a spam fashion, the only way to go in the large category. Thoughts?

 

And with the wonderful and eye opening discussion, my list has changes to the following:

 

Kepotle

Kepotle

Beta orb + 3 galen escorts (I'm not sure this is legal, but I can't find anything saying this is unuseable. I'm sure I can't, but I'm throwing it out there anyway. If illegal, assume another squad of platos, or suggest something for the 165 points)

Platos

Hyperbius

Thales

Thales

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Had a game today with the kepotle.

Even wave lurking its AD is pretty formidable.

1st shot of the game it triple crit an Ecuyer and straight out lazed it in half! From the opposite side of the board! A little lucky for sure, but something to remember. Staying under the surface, while keeping in RB4 meant it survived untouched.

I also had a Diophantus with Galens that drove up the board, getting both broadsides into play. With the Galens linking with the broadsides it becomes a formidable attack. The Dio took a few shots but also suffered no damage mostly due to its DR of 7. I feel we can be pretty aggressive with it now.

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2 games against chinese federation, and it was a mixed bag result. My first list was the same as my first post but with a beta orb in place of the extra 95 points I was missing. Drones are horrid now. He did not take any carriers, so I decided on all dive bombers. Admittedly, I rolled poorly with the new rules, but with how slow they are my opponent was getting AA shots at them initially half the time, I would lose 2-3 and MAYBE get back 1. Then they would bomb, I'd lose 1-2 more and the resulting attack did nothing. His local support SAS also crippled many drone units just enough to smack their effectiveness. He took his in groups of 3-3-3-1, seemed to work just fine as he would outthreat my slow SAS and then not care when they died. Not having to worry as much about the relaunches seems to be a big burden off the enemy. Coupled with their ludicrously offensive speed, they were simply order milkers as I feared. The periclese did manage to murder some mediums on it's own as well as a few smalls, but completely lacked the survivability to remain face to face with anything that has more than 12AD. The torps were the most effective weapon, and it bogged down prior to boarding. But, the kepotles are a thing of wonder. Where the drones and the periclese could not fight out of a wet paper bag, this unit was stellar. The squadron sat back and murdered one of his larges, then swooped in and prized his admiral through boarding! I couldn't believe how good it felt to throw 10 elite dice at an enemy ship. The beta orb continued to be fantastic, setting up the attack run that ended the game on the enemy admiral while toasting smalls and the random medium that came into range with the platos assistance.

 

I found that 2 hyperbii is a little excessive. While Iike having one for sure, as it's ability to deal with aerial threats is too impressive to ignore, 2 wastes points in 1250 naval games. That was my mistake. The thales were absolutely brilliant, and the dios aided in keeping the enemy small threats away from the thales as they positioned to take out enemy mediums. The platos, while I love them, always feel out of sorts in CoA and even more so now. Each other model had a very specific role to play, the platos can do just about anything they have to. But don't mistake the weird feel for poor performance, they are almost a necessity if you want to be fluid with your game plan. 

 

Now, the second game. Again, against the chinese federation. He used a different list that was not so large heavy and brought with him a couple of those floating a-hole boxes of doom. I took my second list as above. This game was almost a non-contest from the start. The first kepotle crit one of the boxes first turn and teleported it way forward where it subsequently died to the platos. The hyperbius from it's advanced position flew in and painted the admiral ship. Then other kepotle squadron proceeded to double crit his admiral shutting down it's engines and AD which he struggled mightly to fix (2 turns). The platos stayed central to deal with any falterings from my line while the beta orb with escort, hyperbius, and thales closes in on targets of opportunity lavishing in the covering barrage from the kepotles. He did well, managing to kill all the forward elements by the end of the 4th turn, but the keptoles were now in position to move in for the kills and both units prized a captial ship (one medium, one large).

 

So, here are the unit ratings for those things I took, in my mind with a couple games under my belt:

 

LARGES

 

Kepotle: ***** 

From now on, there is no Aristotle for me. There is no Keppler. There is only kepotle. And Kepotle is great. The middling defensive stats of each ship coordinate well, though if you target the keppler first there is a slight struggle with rockets. But they do work together incredibly well. It did not feel excessive to have 2, and secondary weapons of the sort they bring are a real boon when things get close. But there isn't terribly much to worry about. The AA support made my opponent wonder about boarding the aristotle, and the crew numbers of the keppler is just enough with the aristotle's support to deter boards until they recieve the proper attention from enemy fire. I found that by getting such powerful attacks in with the alpha was just so brutally damaging that it increased the aristotle's survivability immensly.

 

Periclese: **.5

I liked it in theory, but drones are so incredibly horrid now that it just isn't worth taking. It pays too much for carrier 9 for the firepower it brings. It still suffers from a lack of ability to coordinate it's AD to cripple a ship, and it is not a ship built for a firefight. A list can be built to suit it, but the thing needs massive support. I don't need to try to make this thing work, as drones simply aren't worth a heavy points investment anymore. Back to the shelf with the periclese.

 

Beta orb: *****

I still think there is not reason at all not to have one. Indsicriminate blasts are awesome, though unreliable. But now that we have another squadron in the kepotle that can actually board to an extent, that speed boost is even more amazing. I will be very VERY hard pressed not to have on in every list.

 

MEDIUMS

 

Platos: ***.5

They do feel ackward as they are the one swiss army knife we have in a room full of specific medical instruments. They do a little of everything well, nothing great, but still have issues tackling larges outside of RB2. They fill a quality role and can cover a lists weakness to an extent as long as that weakness isn't dealing with larges. Not a bad choice.

 

Hyperbius: ****

Still an excellent source of anti-aerial models, and now that kepotles are a must have for me these rate highly in my book. That target painter, coupled with it's maneuverability, and a speed boost really help it get the kepotles working. 2 was excessive, and while one has great firepower I felt there was definitely diminshing returns. If there are two kepotles in your list, maybe a second is worth while, but that is a choice I leave to the user. I'd rather have more tools.

 

SMALLS

 

Diogenes: ***

They do what they do, kill smalls from range band 4, 3, 2, and 1. But they always did that. And CoA as a whole has little issues with this, so I think while they offer another reliable source of long ranging killing power they are not a must have. But, no one could fault you for having them.

 

Thales: ****

Cheap, fast (especially with a beta around), and just hitty enough to be a problem. These little guys provide a 100 point unit that simply cannot be ignored. This relieves tons of stress to the rest of the fleet as they will either cripple ships that ignore them or eat shots while the rest of the fleet cripples them instead. Very vulnerable to boarding coupled with their want to be a close range threat option is their biggest problem, and it is easy to lose them all in a single turn to shooting and boarding actions. But, if your skill cap is high enough, I have to argue they are the top small unit we have given their price and numbers.

 

Galens: ***.5

I liked these guys. In the first game I felt the beta was too easy to kill once cornered, but in the second game the escorts really gave a survivability boost. Assuming it is legal to place escorts with the beta orb (no one has said no yet), they do have their uses. But with kepotles being the most viable large option we have they cannot attach there any longer. And our dreadnaughts are still fairly pitiful looking on paper, so I can't comment there this rating is very much so up in the air. I am least confident with them, and will have to continue to play test. If it is NOT legal to use them with beta orbs, then the rating immediatly drops to null and I will try them with a dio or prometheus.

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