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AVelie

Cloak & Artillery

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Actually, Cloak specifically only works against Main Ordnance, and I can't find anywhere that states Artillery is Main Ordnance... It's in a very separate section from Main Ordnance too, and a whole bunch of rules all too itself.

From a 'realism' perspective, I'm also unsure how being invisible is going to protect you from carpet bombing/one massive explosion right on top of your position... :P

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I think Artillery is meant to represent a barrage of shells (or one massive shell) just slamming into the ground, damaging anything that is too close, as opposed to firing accurate shots at anything with a fire zone. :)

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Aye, arty not being MO kinda nixes the effectiveness of Cloak against it.

 

Honestly there is little that does counter/get around Cloak, right now they're all Nexus related.

 

On a side note, wanna see smoke come out of a new Relth player's ears? Tag one of their big fliers with the Target Lock and main cannons of the Dindrenzi Firepower Leviathan. Nexus Designator still hits on 4's with exploding dice, you still throw enough dice to hurt them if the Target Lock succeeds, pull off the pinpoint and they might cry, and thanks to Independent Targeting you can still throw the interceptor shots at their lighter fliers.

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The nexus isn't a main ordinance attack but surely the artillery that is called down is. Otherwise -2 dr no saves except shields, the -2 was bollocks enough let alone the only people who get saves against it are the only ones who actually have artillery. Artillery needs to be nerfed

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No. There is not enough artillery to justify it being nerfed, let alone enough that actually hits on target.

 

I suggest that you listen to the wisdom of the Vanguards. Play some more games & post your results before screaming for the nerf-bat...

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Just because I dont comment on forums doesn't mean I haven't played games. and the only time artillery sucks is when you don't zero them in either that or people just don't know how to use them. I think you just need to play decent players who can place artillery and then youll realise that im right. -2 is to harsh -1 at least. Last time one artillery hit it took out three light tanks who panicked and damaged a heavy who panicked and took another damage. Yeah thats not op at all. BRING ME MY BAT!!!!

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Just because I dont comment on forums doesn't mean I haven't played games. and the only time artillery sucks is when you don't zero them in either that or people just don't know how to use them. I think you just need to play decent players who can place artillery and then youll realise that im right. -2 is to harsh -1 at least. Last time one artillery hit it took out three light tanks who panicked and damaged a heavy who panicked and took another damage. Yeah thats not op at all. BRING ME MY BAT!!!!

That is, using averages off the top of my head, 11 successes (2 for each light, and 5 for the Heavy). That means that your opponent rolled (statistically) 14 AD on 4d6. After he somehow managed to land the template touching 4 of your models. Then you failed at least 2 disorder checks, the first admittedly requiring 3 successes (unlikely on 3 dice, but not impossible. Inside command radius the extra dice should have got you through though), but the second only needed one success on 3 dice.

This doesn't sound like artillery is overpowered, this sounds like it simply worked for your opponent. If you cluster up around his artillery markers and he manages to drop the hammer, that's going to happen though.

Now, I do think we need to get rid of Double Designator artillery models, or cut their AD back so it's not an almost automatic 'zero then drop' situation anywhere within 36" of them. But the Artillery mechanics themselves seems to be fine.

And I'm saying that having been on the receiving end of an absolute flogging due to artillery. ;)

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Failing disorder tests is inherent to anything, it's not something you can link to Artillery as an example of it's OP power, so the fact they took more damage from failed disorders is redundant for how powerful it is, especially in the case of the heavy who only took 1 damage, that's just called unlucky on your part, which this is a dice game, it happens.

 

Artillery has an inherent nature that it is hardly reliable, the dice pool it brings is very random and it only strikes you once per an artillery marker, since you remove the marker once you've used it. The hit may be really powerful if rolled well, or terrible if rolled poorly, because on average most people roll 4D6 for their artillery dice pools, which is suppose to be an average of 14 dice or some such, overall not that much really unless the 6s run away. I've had an artillery strike my main turtle armoured cluster and the only damage I recieved was a Retaliator that took 1 DR from the pool of 11 dice he rolled, because really, even with -2 to DR he would have been lucky to have killed a single Retaliator medium crawler with that strike since they're still DR 5+5.

 

Artillery has it's uses, but it's far from OP, usually Artillery does most damage to Lights and Infantry making it good for camping objectives but noting more, as on average without a lot of luck you'll be lucky to kill off more than 1 medium tank at best with the strike. So no, I don't think it's OP, and I think citing fluke cases where it does get amazingly lucky doesn't mean it is OP or needs nerfing, as anything can get lucky and score overboard.

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Funny enough. each time I played against a decent player who used Artillery, he placed the markers right...but sometimes just have no luck with dice rolled and deviation. Just to say, even Zero'ed in is not certain to drop right where you want it.

 

Also, the fact I'm forcing him to make choices and not just waiting for the big hit to come down doesn't help him. ;)

 

It's not overpowered. It can be stopped, actually. No need to nerf that.

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Its horrible when the sorylian player rolls up 30 AD against you, but then its hilarious when it comes up 5AD, its so varied that you cant rely on it.

Say an average of 17.5 AD from the sorylians (14 from anyone else), thats nasty, and against -2 dr even more so. But its one shot, i would rather face that than be on the receiving end of one of my heavy infantry spires, 15 cqb followed up by 25 AD in the rear arc makes artillery seem pretty tame by comparison. And with movement after a zeroed in drop, its technically even more precise.

Let the sorylians and terrans have their cloak ignoring artillery, everyone needs a strong tool in their arsenal :)

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-IMHO artillery is random. And in planetfall the best way to counteract randomness is to buy up lots of it or use none at all.

-Artillery is **** when you have one token, good when you have 3 or 4 and awesome when you have 5 or 6.

-The double nexus designators the sorylian heavies have make them seriously dangerous as your opponents cant see where its coming next and plan to avoid it. 

 

Long story short, small differences in the artillery numbers and designator numbers make a big difference in effect.

I dont think it requires a nerf per se but evening out that curve from brilliant to mediocre could be good.

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I have actually had my opponents cursing when they zeroed in a marker as my models we just far enough past it that he would have rather had 2d6 and no re-roll, rather than a re-roll and a D6 needing that 5 or 6 to clip me.

 

If you play someone and all their artillery comes in perfect for them, then you will cry yourself to sleep at night about how painful it was, but that should be a fluke, and if its not then I would love to read some battle reports on that cause it would be great to see what he is doing so I can prepare myself for how to avoid it.

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Artillery is 75% area denial to me, the other 25% is when you can bring enough to make a legit threat. All it really does the vast amount of time is gives your opponent sa reason NOT to take the direct route or to not focus on an area. I'm generally not paying attention to if any models in my lists save it till I'm at the table, then again I play Dindrenzi and Aquans.

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The Artillery procedures on pages 82-84 never state which dice mechanic to use, unlike everything else in the Rulebook, nor do they directly indicate where you should go to find out, so this is a valid concern.

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Page 29 

"Most Dice Rolls in Planetfall will use the Exploding Dice mechanic as a means of generating hits."

 

The rest of dice rolls follow this rule:

"There will be occasions in-game where the rules will note that a Dice Roll must use the Basic / Heavy Dice mechanic."

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