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Garthim

Oroshan Battle: Bad luck or Bad Tactics?

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Played my first game with Oroshan the other day. Border Clash, 800 points, friend was Sorylians.

 

My fleet:

 

Harbinger class Battle Carrier (weapon shielding, +4 capacity, and all bombers) with two grief class escorts with +2 PD

 

One full squadron of Defiler class Cruisers

 

2 full squadrons of Slayer class Frigates.

 

My friends fleet:

 

Swordbreaker class Battleship with two escorts

 

Full squadron of Skyhammer class Cruisers

 

2 full squadrons of Reaper class Frigates with pack hunter

 

Friend keeps Swordbreaker and escorts in reserve. I win first init roll, move up and fire the Defilers at the Skyhammers, but do no damage. A Reaper squadron activates, hides in a gas cloud, and cripple a Defiler. Activate a squadron of Slayers to try and blast the Reapers, destroy 2. Skyhammer squad activates and moves up. Harbinger moves up. Second Reaper squad moves up and I move up Slayers to engage next turn.

 

Second turn, he wins init. Skyhammers lay into Defilers, destroy the crippled one and cripple two more. Slayers try to blast the Reapers again and do nothing. Reapers in gas cloud destroy the crippled Defilers. Harbinger and Escorts get their port guns, turret of the battle carrier, and a bomber squadron on skyhammers and cripple two of them. The second Reaper squadron attempt to board a ghost station terrain piece but fail. Second Slayer squadron attacks second Reapers, one hit point off two Reapers. Last Defiler has no where he can really go without exposing his rear and not being to utilize his forward guns, so just moves half his movement score up so he is still facing down the skyhammer cruisers.

 

Third turn, he wins init.  Reapers try to hit last Defiler and do nothing. Defiler tries to fire at a crippled skyhammer cruiser to do some damage, but fails to do anything. Cruisers open up on Slayers with scatter guns and leave only 2 left and they fail disorder test. Harbinger and escorts destroy a cruiser and nothing to the other. We had to call it then due to time constrictions.

 

Bad rolls or bad tactics on my part? Thoughts or suggestions?

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Honestly, you lost initiative multiple times against Sorylians... That alone sounds like bad luck!

The Defilers getting messed up was also a bit of bad luck, but not entirely surprising going against pretty much the whole Sorylian fleet.

How were you running the Slayers? Against other tier 3's I like to use my squads with three ships ganging up on one of theirs. That gives me 2 attacks with 10 AD each and makes the best use of Pack Hunters.

Other then that the best I can say is to try and keep together, it sounds like half of your force didn't do anything the first turn and if they had been closer to the Defilers they might have been able to make a difference. I sometimes forget that when I'm deploying and try to spread out along the deployment zone so everything is as far forward as possible to get into rb2 faster, but our guys are great at rb3 also so they can go two or three ships deep in the same deployment area and still be viable. Also our PD is **** so some Interceptors or fighters to cover the fleet might be helpful against torpedoes. (I know we're limited there too even with the battle "carrier")

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Don't field 9 Bombers. Instead, use six bombers and three interceptors. And if you use bombers, your second hard point should help you deliver them... So take shields or movement.

Further, if you take escorts with PD, you don't really need interceptors.

Personally, I would turn it into a battle basalt carrier. Take 3-5 interceptors, all the assault upgrades for the carrier and escorts, and high energy for the beam weapons. Pick a target and try to hit it with two teams every turn, so you can pile on those hazard markers. At the end of turn three, they should be near zero crew (especially if the cruisers help out). Then assault with 6-12AP hitting on 3+. In theory, you would have good odds to capture your target.

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Don't field 9 Bombers. Instead, use six bombers and three interceptors. And if you use bombers, your second hard point should help you deliver them... So take shields or movement.

Further, if you take escorts with PD, you don't really need interceptors.

Personally, I would turn it into a battle basalt carrier. Take 3-5 interceptors, all the assault upgrades for the carrier and escorts, and high energy for the beam weapons. Pick a target and try to hit it with two teams every turn, so you can pile on those hazard markers. At the end of turn three, they should be near zero crew (especially if the cruisers help out). Then assault with 6-12AP hitting on 3+. In theory, you would have good odds to capture your target.

 

 

Funny enough it was all the bombers that allowed me to do most of my damage to the skyhammers cause so many got through.  The carrier suffered some bad rolls, like with its beam turret at range band 2 (8 AD) needing 4+, I rolled out of the batch, only one 4.  Yup that kind of bad rolling for most of its guns that game...... 

 

The battleship....er..I mean battle carrier worked well enough that I felt with better rolls, it could have done a ton more damage.

 

 

Honestly, you lost initiative multiple times against Sorylians... That alone sounds like bad luck!

The Defilers getting messed up was also a bit of bad luck, but not entirely surprising going against pretty much the whole Sorylian fleet.

How were you running the Slayers? Against other tier 3's I like to use my squads with three ships ganging up on one of theirs. That gives me 2 attacks with 10 AD each and makes the best use of Pack Hunters.

Other then that the best I can say is to try and keep together, it sounds like half of your force didn't do anything the first turn and if they had been closer to the Defilers they might have been able to make a difference. I sometimes forget that when I'm deploying and try to spread out along the deployment zone so everything is as far forward as possible to get into rb2 faster, but our guys are great at rb3 also so they can go two or three ships deep in the same deployment area and still be viable. Also our PD is **** so some Interceptors or fighters to cover the fleet might be helpful against torpedoes. (I know we're limited there too even with the battle "carrier")

 

I know, I lost Init to the Iggys, I bow my head in shame.

 

I had the Slayers firing in groups of two on each frigate so I could chuck out 7 AD at each one (and being non capitals, hitting on 4+, yeah!)

 

When I took the opening shots with the Defilers at the Skyhammer on the first turn, I had them at RB 3 hoping to get some early game sniping shots in but got nothing.  Had the squadorn pair up with 6 AD with the beams for each pair and got nothing.

 

Someone in my group suggested I should have taken the Defilers as two squadrons of two ships, and had them hang back using their beam and torps more like a sniper style gunship would in the other fleets and let the Slayers be my main DPS and the carrier be more of a mop up role.  Thoughts?

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There are some instances where throwing more attacks with less dice works well and part of the game is figuring out when that is. In both instances you mentioned (3x7AD vs the Reaper or 2x6AD vs the Falcatas) you would probably be better off to link more ships for the higher AD (2x10 in the case of the Reapers and 1x10 AD for the Falcata). In both of those instances you have an equal or higher on average chance to do damage and a much better chance to score crits. (3x7AD on average 0 crits/3 hits, 2x10AD on average 2 crit/4hit vs a Reaper) (2x6AD on average 0 crits/2 hits, 1x10AD on average 1 crit/2hit vs a Falcata).

 

I can literally think of no good reason to take the Defilers in two squadrons instead of just one squadron. Even if you do split their fire (which I only recommend in a closer range band where their AD is high enough to really justify the split) you're still better off to keep them in the same squad and just choose separate squadrons to target.

 

Sorry for the ramble and pseudo maths lesson :P

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The only thing I can guess with the Defiler thing is you get another activation and try to use that to your advantage.  I like full squadrons cause I dont like giving away battle log points like easter eggs so I was uneasy about it.

 

So you recommend dont just go for damage, just blow them away.  Huh, the reason I am passionately in love with Dindrenzi, lol. I will try it in my next game. 

 

Another thing that was suggested was I could have dropped one of the Slayer squadrons and one of the Defilers from the squad and picked up a Spur Battlecruiser with some upgrades.  Thoughts? 

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Defiler plinking only makes sense if you use High Energy, so you can pile up the Hazard Markers for Crew Loss and Boarding. Also you should always fully upgrade but the Defilers.

How were you running your nine bombers? Remember, you can only launch one Token per turn, and a max of six Wings per Token. Also, you can't move Wings around between Tokens.

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It sounds like the Sorylians took the defensive terrain too. That increased the difficulty in causing damage to them.

 

Also - try to mitigate your movement until you get the best shots. For example if you move full speed and end in a poor range band, hold back so when your opponent moves, they are also in a poor range band not their best.

 

Not sure if you did that or not, but I see this as a flaw in many player's tactics.

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Defiler plinking only makes sense if you use High Energy, so you can pile up the Hazard Markers for Crew Loss and Boarding. Also you should always fully upgrade but the Defilers.

How were you running your nine bombers? Remember, you can only launch one Token per turn, and a max of six Wings per Token. Also, you can't move Wings around between Tokens.

 

A token of five and a token of four.  First turn I launched the five token then launched the other in the following turn.  Didnt loose any to PD from the enemy.  I got lucky there.

 

It sounds like the Sorylians took the defensive terrain too. That increased the difficulty in causing damage to them.

 

Also - try to mitigate your movement until you get the best shots. For example if you move full speed and end in a poor range band, hold back so when your opponent moves, they are also in a poor range band not their best.

 

Not sure if you did that or not, but I see this as a flaw in many player's tactics.

 

Very good point.  I am realizing I played the Oroshan took much like my aggressive Dindrenzi and feeling like I need to play the Oroshan more like Directorate to an extent.  New fleet, new learning curve. 

 

I am surprised he kept the defensive terrain as long as he did given how his admiral wasn't on the table and he had to make disorder test very turn, but he also made each one up until we had to call it, dastardly calm and patient lizards. 

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