Jump to content


  • Posts

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won


Everything posted by Xystophoroi

  1. A WW2 naval wargame I am enjoying right now is Victory at Sea, in that weapons are divided into a few broad types - secondary weapons (6 inch guns, 5.4 inch, etc.), turreted guns (essentially anything 8 inches and up to the 18 inch guns on the Yamato), torpedoes and bombs. Plus a few specialised things like depth charges/double squid/etc. Small ships like destroyers only have secondary guns and torpedoes (usually enough for one volley). Cruisers and up have at least one turret. Those small Secondary guns essentially can't hurt battleships and in some cases it's literally impossible (King George V, Yamato, etc. are entirely immune to those small guns). Torpedoes however can do a huge amount of damage, even to a tough battleship and a torpedo belt can only do so much. Instead it means the destroyers have to be evasive to close into torpedo range and then unload a full load of them, while using their smaller guns to duel with the enemy small ships. The game does not suffer from having those small ships guns being unable to hurt the toughest battleships. === Another popular game is Flames of War and in that it's not uncommon to have tanks utterly immune to vast swathes of weaponry. What's the rifle section meant to do when the Panzer 4 rolls over the hill towards them? Bugger off and hope the PIAT can deal with it. What happens when the Sherman's 75mm gun can't get through the glacis of the Panther? It either calls in the M10 or Firefly or looks to get flanking shots. === Basically I don't agree that having some class of units/weapons being unable to harm another class is bad.
  2. Just as a note from Firestorm, the Foldspace Escape to get your damaged ships off the table to reduce the amount of points given up to the opponent if they destroy them is mostly a waste of time. The main use is as bait to force your opponent to follow up and focus fire to kill the escaping ship. The issue with the Foldspace Escape is that to do it you must sacrifice all of your offensive capability the turn you activate it AND spend at least one full turn unable to move or attack, potentially 2 full turns depending on when you activate the squadron trying to escape. If you're in a position to have picked up enough damage to want to escape then coming to a full stop and losing all offensive capability for 1 and a bit turns just guarantees you'll die (excepting dice randomness). You end up in a position where a Battleship (8hp normally) needs to start charging the fold space drives to escape once it has taken 2hp damage otherwise it wont have the hp to actually survive the time needed to charge the drives to escape. --- Conversely I've been playing some Victory at Sea (ww2 naval combat, not a rivet counting sim, focus is instead on having you make similar choices to a 'real captain' even if the reason you make those choices is game mechanics and not realistic simulation. E.g.: when on the offense crossing the T should be your aim but if you're in pursuit you want to be in line ahead formation) and that has the big ships (even some of the medium ships) with a lot of hp and it's more difficult to remove critical hit effects. E.g.: a single hit from a 16 inch gun deal between 0 and 3 hp damage (unless a crit effect does bonus damage). The King George V class battleship has 39hp (and is crippled when it has 13 hp left). Actually sinking that thing is a monumental task that really only combined fire from multiple ships with multiple big guns (really looking at at least 10 inch plus) stands a chance of doing it over an extended number of turns. Instead it tends to pick up crit effects that reduce it's effectiveness and as these kinds of gunnery duels are essentially races a crit that prevents you turning to bring the rear turrets into arc a few times can be all it takes to make it impossible to realistically win that race so the only sensible choice is to withdraw the ship, doing what it can while it does so.
  3. The Hasta gets my vote as the best Battlecruiser if taken in a pair. Single broadsides have 11 dice, linking for 16. 2 single 11s can score 2 crits on a cruiser so the squadron can reliably destroy a ship per side per turn. Scatter so they do it ot smalls as well. They reliably take HP from big ships. Add in all the bells and whistles and they have weapon shielding and good shields. They come with bigger batteries for increased range on their PD. They can both carry 3 wing tokens of interceptors to provide their squadron an absurd amount of PD as well as granting that PD to every squadron around them. They're not that slow and they come with a big forward facing kinetic providing their normally short ranged fleet with the ability to attack early at range which they normall lack. It's a 300pt package at that point but it grants the fleet a huge and flexibly positioned PD bubble on a decently tough package that degrades slowly, has great damage output left and right on a decently mobile platform that can target any sized ship and has a potent long ranged forward gun. In the context of the Sorylian fleet it's an excellent choice. Covering several weaknesses (long ranged guns, bringing SRS) whilst also retaining the factions biggest strengths to allow it to fit in with the mission plan of the rest of the fleet.
  4. The Skyhammer is my number 1. Fast, large squadrons, weapons in multiple arcs, great against all ship types. Splitting broadsides for 2*12AD left and right gives good odds of blowing up an enemy cruiser in two arcs per turn, 8AD scatter shreads almost every small so you can destroy or cripple multiple t3 squadrons with a single activation. Fprewar firing the scatter still does th ejob for a couple of hits, plus 10AD torpedoes.
  5. For those of us not in the know, what does the consolidation in DW look like? Removing factions? As in, no more Ryushi ever. Or just merging them together so instead of being able to play an Omnidyne fleet you instead take a 'Directorate' fleet and take 90% of the ships as Omnidyne models?
  6. I'm going to Salute this year in London on the 14th. I note that Wayland have a stall, any chance there will be anything Firestorm to pick up or being talked about there?
  7. I am all for getting characterful new buffs for the Sorylians but I want to step in and say that reliance on Shunt Entry is, I think hugely overstated. As in. I do worse when I use Shunt Entry as Sorylians. Deploying on the table and driving across it has yielded better results for me, consistently. The big thing is accepting you are doing nothing of note for the first two turns and instead hiding behind any terrain feature that'll have you. You're fast, your guns have 16" optimal range on commonly 10" movement hulls. In a single turn you can reach out and hit something ~26" away with optimal firepower (more realistically something 22" once you accommodate for turns, arc optimising, etc.). You need to huddle for PD cover form interceptors. It's lame but it's needed. The problem is predictability. Typically a non-shunt game looks like this 0. Deploy behind 1/2AD cover 1. Move forward, staying behind 1/2AD cover, take a few random HP from torps getting through PD or lucky shots going through 1/2AD 2. Repeat previous turn, if something would be in range if you just darted out to attack it and left your cover...don't dart out, it's more important to arrive as a coordinated force than to dash around chasing hits. Hopefully you've minimised incoming damage, maybe a random torpedo has done something to one of their ships, not really important. 3. Your fleet comes out all at once, drives to max, etc. you get as many ships into arc and mixed into their fleet as possible and just open up. Your range and speed means that most of your ships should be perfectly capable of opening up on them in at least two arcs. Looking to secure kills. Basically you're trying to make it so the game doesn't get to happen in any meaningful way until turn 3. The issue I found with Shunt Entry reliance was that things arrived in dribs and drabs and would get focus fired. It depended on winning initiative to get use out of it's shunted ships. It relied on additional resources like TAC to arrive when you needed them to. The 50% you'd put on the table just gets beaten up because they can focus fire more. At time constrained things like tournaments I'd find missions had gone past the critical point before things had enough time to Shunt in. Considering your speed and weapon range you're better Flanking than Shunting but even then I'd only do it with something that I won't mind missing out on for a little while. Now, is this competitive? Not really. Best I did with Sorylians is 3rd at Reading but I did find that abandoning the Shunt Focus helped me win more and enjoy playing them more. it's just lame that the faction that attracted me to them because they were 'super tough' have to hide for half the game (either off table flank/shunt or crawling behind rocks) to have a chance of surviving long enough to have a chance of winning.
  8. How do WW2 aircraft and fighter escorts protect warships from incoming enemy aircraft? Or convoy escorts protect merchant ships against submarine wolf packs? Could either or both be implemented here? Pretty sure neither were big on physically blocking incoming shots with their hulls so much as creating danger zones the attacker could not move into without the threat of retaliation taking them down. I.e.: picture less 'I am the shield and you have to get through me to get to my charge!' and more 'incoming enemy fighters detected, 50 miles out, on intercept course with our fleet, contact in 20 minutes, scramble fighters, take them down before they reach us!'
  9. Mission kill vs actual kill. I dig it.
  10. Yes, I am a fan of the battlelog and the incentives it provides to withdraw to save lives and extremely valuable war materiel. An example of rules feeding into theme and setting. It's an intragalactic war fought using massive ships with many lives and huge resource investments. You can't just waste lives and ships in pursuit of victory in this one engagement if it deprives you of an effective fleet in being, etc.
  11. I believe that's already a rule - if your Battlelog ever gets to the maximum negative you immediately FSD the entire fleet and lose. Happened to me at reading Warfare once. AGainst some gorgeous purple and bone/white Veydreth. My Sorylians vs Veydreth, Veydreth gunships floated forward and crit my Battleship turn 1 with their beams, they did the same on turn 2 leaving it on 4HP half way up the table and in range of every beam in the Veydreth fleet with the rest of their fleet still to activate.
  12. Yes, basically because of things like the game state required to get a Battleship down at 4hp and likely use cases of a battleship (actually getting into weapon range to fight) if you wait too long (with too long being ~4hp in my experience) the time spent charging up the FSD just gets it killed and it;s usually worth it for the big battle log swing taking out a battleship is worth. You often don't even have to overexpose yourself to get those last hits on the ship either as many ships have weapons in multiple arcs so they still contribute to fighting the rest of the enemy fleet while putting a weapon system on the battleship.
  13. It dies. Consider the table situation that has left a battleship on 2hp. How did it drop that low? Enemies must be in range to hit it with enough firepower to at least overcome DR and shields right? It is unlikely you can degrade enemy squadrons fast enough to prevent them putting those remaining HP on the battleship before it is able to sit still for 2 turns (or 1 full turn if you activate the battleship as your last activation) and charge up the FSD. Hell a single crit would take it out and most battleships are in the 11CR range...a linked squadron can get there fairly reliably and taking out a battleship is a lot of battle log so it's often worth it to sacrifice ships for that kill. In my games i have found that if you're using the battleship to actually fight then once it hits 4hp it's not going to be able to escape - unless it was some lucky early criticals while it is still deep on your half of the table.
  14. Who said they're leaving without orders? Edit: Also, entire reams of military theory are about breaking morale so I'd go with the suspicion that most commanders know troops on both sides will run away regardless of their orders to the contrary.
  15. Would like to see more Fold Space escaping really, making it less of a mostly stupid option would be a plus. I think that currently Battleships really need to be starting their jump preparations when they're down to 6hp remaining if they actually want to escape. If you wait to be a half HP (about 4) then your ship is in a situation where it has been under enough firepower to be vulnerable which means it's probably in fighting range and the ships that took it to 4hp are probably just waiting for their chance to do another bit of damage. Several turns of sitting exposed is not a good idea and those kinds of ships usually don't have the speed and maneuverability to hide on a part of the table that will keep them safe for 2 turns of inactivity. And yes, I know, we're not wet navy operations but the Bismarck (and Prince Eugen) fought with the Hood and Wales, Hood was destroyed and Wales escaped to tail the German ships. Bismarck took 3 hits and was badly damaged enough to need to cancel their mission and try to escape to return to base for repairs. The closest thing we have for our ships in the real world try to - and succeed - in escaping (Wales got away from the battle of the Denmark Strait) and ships taking damage return to base (mission kills rather than actual kills). For me it feels more thematic for ships to try and escape as much as possible rather than fighting and dying. It makes it feel like there are real people on board and that there are bigger strategic concerns in a massive intragalactic war than this single engagement.
  16. Wrath of Kings has a different activation system, related to the 'Alternating Activations' style. You have a number of models, they can activate as individuals. You also have 'command' figures who can activate multiple models as a single activation. Both players trade activating a model/group if a 'commander' orders it like 'Alternating Activations'. Once one player has run out of activations their opponent gets to make ONE more activation, then the turn ends. You are rewarded for being as efficient with your models and 'commanders' as possible and it removes the 'activation advantage' issue that can occur in some 'Alternating Activation' games. It's probably not offering much to FSA as spamming tiny squadrons for activation advantage is not currently a good idea for other reasons so most fleets are usually within +/-1 squadron of each other. ==== Another activation system I have seen is one where the player rolls a handful of dice (about 4 I think) and can spend the results to do things. Lower results let them move smaller/weaker stuff and you can spend higher results to be lower results. E.g.: 1 = move a T3 squadron 2 = move a T2 squadron 3 = Move a non-Dreadnought T1 Squadron 4 = Move a Dreadnought Squadron 5 = Something special 6 = End the turn Once you have rolled and spent your dice your opponent rolls and spends theirs. You could repeatedly activate the same squadron if you wanted to (with probably some degrading effect if you do so too many times). The 5 does something special which could be worked out later. The 6 ends the turn. Only by one player spending a 6 do any of the 'end of turn' effects like repairs, returning SRS to base, etc. occur. The idea is to simulate a kind of ebb and flow of periods of intense activity followed by a lull period. ==== not saying any are necessarily good for FSA, just that there are more 'turn systems' out there to maybe steal ideas from.
  17. @Frans How do you forsee combat in space as being different from 'Naval' space combat games? How does a ships/squadron's movement differ between the two systems? I really like the thematic stuff like being able to go belly up, or perhaps front over back to face directly behind you (then continue moving in the original direction of movement at half speed as you decelerate that way and then go back where you came from). Maybe boarding has to be done with short range teleporters rather than trying to explain away the speed boarding craft would slam into the enemy hull. Bombers dropping stuff is probably not a thing and instead 'bombers' are firing high payload torpedoes at short ranges.
  18. I suggest 1. the big criticals that cause 'one hit KO' potential should be rarer or only be possible once a ship has already sustained meaningful damage so that a turn one lucky crit does not cripple a battleship. E.g.: something like if you roll a double 1 the target ship takes either +1 damage and choose a status effect if over half HP or if under half HP +2 damage and choose two status effects 2. You only roll to repair status effect at the END of the squadron's activation (or some other time tied to the ships in questions) so that you have a longer period of time to both suffer under the effects and a longer period of time in which to exploit the effects of enemy status effects. Rolling to shut down the enemy shields as the last activation of your turn and then having them just repair immediately renders the whole endeavour of rolling for a crit irrelevant. If you go for 2 allow the Experienced Engineers MAR to roll to repair at the start of the squadron activation or if TACs are still around use the Focused Repair TAC at the start of the turn to guarantee Crit Removal, etc.
  19. I hope they just entirely get rid of the proximity vectoring stuff. Let people remove models from their flight stems when things get in close. Just treat the base footprint and flight stem as what matters mechanically. Let people change their flight stem height to suit their preference. If you need to then make the base size an actual model stat to keep it consistent (like Wrath of Kings does).
  20. I prefer the game be designed with the idea that I bring my models, dice and book and I am good to go. I dislike having a pile of cards off to the side of the table to track stuff (especially if I bring a fleet of 20+ ships, that's a lot of cards), I don't want the expectation to be that I go and buy a printer so I can play this game, I don't want the expectation that I have to bring a tablet to the table. Plus there is the difficulty of your opponent seeing the state of your fleet if it's tracked on a tablet or an app. They'd have to ask to see the HP, crits, etc. of every ship unless they memorise them as they won't be able to - at a glance from across the table - read your tablet/phone screen. If you want to look at Apps then I suggest looking at the Corvus Belli 'Infinity Army' which is great for list building, great for making stats quickly accessible, links directly to the wiki detailing the special rules, weapon stats, etc. but is only used for reference of those things and model state is tracked on the table with the models.
  21. I preferred the idea of summing the dice for the ships linking ignoring their damage. I.e.: it's mostly fixed for the squadron's different firing solutions. Then, once you've got that mostly fixed dice pool, you remove dice from the final pool equal to damage taken by all the ships linking. E.g.: Sorylian cruisers normally fly in 4s and fire a 4 linked broadside for 20, 2 2 linked for 12 or 4 unlinked for 8 so you've got basically 3 fixed dice pools. You then remove the damage from that total pool as it feels simpler. E.g.: 4 linked for 20, one has taken 2 damage and one has taken 1. Therefore 20-3 damage = 17 dice. Rather than 8+((8/2)+((8-1)/2)+((8-2)/2))/2 = 18 dice. So it ends up as the following common firing solutions: 20 minus damage or 12 minus damage or 8 minus damage
  22. Could you give an example of what you're considering 'crippled' squadrons shooting at each other? I don't know every ship or every combination so i may be missing a fairly large swathe of ships and match ups so that I am not seeing an issue that really is there.
  23. Not really? Individually a single cruiser seems perfectly capable of beating the DR of another cruiser to keep some damage sneaking through and even big dreadnoughts tend to only have a DR of 6 so a damaged squadron linking can still get enough dice to average a point of damage, especially if they get to the rear arc. Plus later in the game PD is reduced, SRS tokens tend to have taken damage or be scattered around a bit more so their PD bubbles are less consistent and thus torpedoes come into some use so sneak through another 1HP here and there.
  24. My preference was for a variation on the proposed 3.0 system that was in playtest. Ships have primary and linked fire values on their weapons (so can be tailored for different roles/variation if desired). Total the number of dice, remove dice equal to damage taken by all ships that are linking together. Roll. The reason the 2.0 'single primary ship, add half other ships' was good was because it allowed individual ships to have dice pools high enough to be a threat to things even operating alone - a 6-8AD attack from a cruiser for example still had a decent chance of scoring 1HP against DR4-6 - without making the AD of a full squadron blow straight past those DR/CR values rendering them largely irrelevant and linked ships hugely powerful. If you tailored the DR/CR values around linked squadrons total AD then you were rendering individual ships broadly useless because they can't reliably generate enough hits to care about when firing alone. The 2.0 1 full, plus half others system got around this by stopping the top end values getting so high. Taskforce showed an example of just straight combining and that game rendered individual ships or badly damaged squadrons playing Yahtzee and hoping for bunches of 6s to do anything. E.g.: a Directorate frigate rolls 2-3 dice when shooting and an Aquan ship might have 5-7 or more DR so individually they were basically pointless and even 3 of them have a hard time. Bear in mind the starter boxes had 2 cruiser equivalents and around 6 smalls, losing either cruiser would render the squadron mostly irrelevant and losing 2-4 of the smalls rendered them irrelevant. Taskforce - as presented in the starter boxes anyway - started with basically guaranteed big hits as defences could not stand up to squadron firepower and then ended as Yahtzee as the only way depleted squadrons could hurt anything was with spiking 6s.
  25. I prefer boxes. I’d also prefer the ships base sizes were standardised and used for all mechanical purposes and never the shop model. Then make the actual ship models smaller and cheaper. Makes transport easier - I carry everything in their fleet boxes wrapped in their bubble wrap, smaller ships fit into smaller boxes and price goes down. standardising away from model size too removes that blocker from mechanical impact.
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.