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Everything posted by MssrKittens

  1. I'm really not looking forward the using Pathogen SRS. Back when I played Relthoza, making bombing runs was the only thing they had going for them; getting that sweet 18 AD bombing attack was pretty awesome. The Pathogen can't get that; basically, they have Assault boats with an extra 4", and twice the cost. I... suppose that's ok, and might make the one-two boarding punch pretty decent if you can keep the Captured Media alive on the Carrier, but I really don't see the point. Basic game design theory: Make models in one of two ways. Either specialists that are fantastic at one thing and suck at everything else, or generalists that are solid at everything, but able to leverage that multi-solidity in more than one way at once. Otherwise, they compare against the specialists and come up short every time. Since Pathogen SRS only have one actual advantage over the normal spread of SRS, that being Assaulting at 12" instead of 8", their range of other strengths is kind of wasted. It's great to have all those other abilities wrapped in to one, but if one can't actually use them, it's just window dressing. Having to pay twice as much to get access to power you're not going to use stings. I'll wait to make up my mind until I've tried them out a few times, but I'm not optimistic.
  2. Before I start this battle report, a note to RedDwarf: Yes, ok, you were right. I hadn't said it, but I doubted you. You were right. ElectricPaladin and I tried out some small lists of the new Marauders fleets to see how they operated. He proxied in his Directorate models for the Corsairs, and I my Relthoza for the Pathogen. Our lists were as follows: Corsairs Battlecarrier with 6 Bombers Full Crusiers, specced out for Defense Full Cruisers, specced out for Damage Full Frigates Full Frgates Pathogen Battleship with two Captured Media Full Cruisers with two Captured Media Full Frigates (reserved) Full Frigates (reserved) Credits to RedDwarf for the list, it worked quite well. So, early game, Paladin maneuvered quite well, and cut off my Cruisers from my Battleship with well-placed mines and a planet, forcing me to lose a turn re-positioning them to get back in to the battle; fortunately, they were still able to contribute some with their 16-die torpedoes (and I have to say, having a legitimate torpedo threat for once was a bizarre and delightful experience). My battleship took a pounding and lost both of its escorts, though Paladin's force did not escape unscathed: he rammed his Cruiser squadrons right through an asteroid belt, taking horrifying damage; I think they took about as much damage as I inflicted with my guns for almost the whole game. Things were looking really bad for a while; my guns did virtually nothing, my ships were pathetically slow and crunchy, and while I was able to do a couple of boarding attacks with my Battleship, 10 dice just doesn't do anything against either a well escorted Battlecarrier or a full Cruiser squadron... to say nothing of the Bombing runs he was making (still super jealous of the ability to take bombers). I was getting ready to chalk this up to another fleet that doesn't function like it said on the box. Then my Cruisers got in to boarding range. I can still hear the screaming. The game turned around pretty fast; in short order, I had a nice new Captured Large, to which my Cruiser Squadron donated their Captured Media, and presto, I had a new damage threat on the board. My guns did eventually do enough damage that my torpedoes started doing significant damage much earlier than usual (still so weird), and the game snowballed from there. It was kind of shocking to watch. Pathogen Takeaways: 1) The Battleship is a big, lumbering distraction. It did a grand total of nothing, except soak up fire and look angry. Its middling guns were brought so low so fast that it couldn't shoot worth a darn, its 10 AP isn't up to the task of doing much on its own (I think it destroyed, but not captured, a Frigate this one time?). But, since it's your Battleship and has your... Admiral?... your opponent is going to want to shoot it. Let 'em. 2) Pay attention to Crew Point damage more than you usually would. Since Crew Point damage, in my experience, typically runs parallel to Hull Point damage, I don't track it mentally unless I'm fighting an opponent with Weapon Shielding (stupid Terrans). However, once your opponent's Tier 1s have taken a few Crew Point losses, jump it with your biggest AP threat as soon as possible. 2a) It's totally legitimate to do Boarding attacks with your Frigates earlier in a turn to target Life Support. 3) Keep your fleet together. Getting separated hurts the Pathogen more than most, I think, due to their slow speed and their proclivity for seeking the one-two boarding punch. 4) Don't have an active imagination. If you picture what's going on in your opponent's fleet (and to their soldiers...) too much, you'll lose some sleep. It's not pleasant. Now, I don't know if this success is repeatable. A force with more range, better boarding itself, or just the Aquans who can kite them all day and literally never have to see a boarding attack could simply press the "off" button to the Pathogen. With only one viable strategy (close, board) they're kind of predictable, and therefore counterable. We'll have to see. None the less, it was nice having a fleet that could actually do... well, anything, really, for a change. Addendum: should I bother posting this to the War Log? It was 10 to -1 (yikes!), but the Marauders aren't being tracked right now.
  3. That's what I figured, but some rules had been overlooked, and it's always worth checking with the devs when stuff's just come out; they're only Human, and could have missed something.
  4. A question that came up during the Pathogen sub-subforum: can Pathogen SRS bomb and board in the same attack run?
  5. Sure, yeah, but if totally ignored, just a few Captured Cruisers can eventually devour your opponent's Frigate Squadrons (it's not an insane scenario to posit they fly up, blow one up, then split up the boarding attacks, and get one or two additional ships per turn), and turn around very big, angry and hungry. I'm not diving right in to it, mind, but that ruling certainly opens up some options.
  6. Has anyone tried them? What are some things to keep in mind, going in to a first game? What are some good tactics? What are some things to avoid? Basically, who's got a primer, here?
  7. Apparently, this means a ship with Captured in its name at all, not just a ship taken mid-mission. This gives an interesting option of creating, perhaps, a "screening" Squadron that can't hurt your Battle Log, and only help it. Huh. Interesting choice.
  8. The system works! And here I was looking forward to running my all-battleship-fleet! Not to be, alas.
  9. I think he was recalling the 5 of the Carrier or the Captured Large. ...Ruling on Captured-Class ships and Battle Log/Fleet Assembly, please? This is an essential ruling, here, folks, and people basically can't play the Pathogen until this is hammered out!
  10. I know, it's just that when you do splut, you might do well to keep that in mind. Alex, or another Spartan employee, can we get a ruling on how the Captured-Class ships interact with fleet assembly, and with the Battle Log? Additionally, I think we should all take Pok's lead, here. When Pathogen Squadrons grow too large and need to form new Squadrons, it's called Splutting. Very onomatopoetic, and that's the most important aspect of canonizing new game terms. Yes I had to use spell-check to get onomatopoetic right.
  11. Well, I think we heard that if a Squadron of Cruisers capture a Large, they have to immediately split, no? Sure, Squadrons growing on their own might not happen much, but Larges don't fit in with Cruisers. Since a fully maxed out Squadron of Cruisers can huck out a profane 24 AP, we should see more than a couple Larges captured by the Pathogen; they would immediately split, and then become a new Squadron (which has then counted as having activated). So, if my opponent then turns around and blows away his newly-improved ship, it doesn't count for Battle Log on his part, but I gain Battle Log for having taken it out, no? This would imply that it's almost always best to split off ships Captured mid-mission, so that your opponent can't double-dip on Battle Log scoring. Interesting.
  12. Still hoping to get a response on how Captured ships fit in to both fleet creation and Battle Log! We know that fleets count Initial size for half, but what about Squadrons that were created mid-mission? Are they really exempt?
  13. So, it's sounding like no Battle Log interactions happen for when a newly-formed Squadron, created entirely out of ships captured mid-mission, get destroyed? That use of the word "initial" implies that these ships, too, operate outside of the mechanics of the game. Also, say I've got a squadron of Cruisers and Captured Cruisers at max capacity, and then I capture one more with them. Since I have to split, I put all of my normal Cruisers in one Squadron, and all of my Captured-types into another. What happens to the activation game? A) Do both Squadrons count as having activated, because they all contain models which have activated? Does the new Squadron count as not having activated, because it's newly formed (and thus is a new Squadron?)
  14. Great to hear, thanks! That helps balance out the expense of Pathogen SRS, if they, too, can be picked up mid-game. A new question: Say I nab a carrier that's been whittled down to 2 SRS tokens left. If that token then kills another SRS token, can it grow up to 3, the Captured Large's limit (since it "was" originally a token of more than 2, its past life), or does it stay at 2, since that's the limit where it first became a Pathogen SRS token?
  15. I'm not talking from a balance standpoint, I'm referring to the fact that the format is a little misleading. Listing 4 potential Accompaniment models available to a unit which can expand to accommodate an extra 2 implies conflicting messages. Had I not stared at the profile for a while, I don't think I would have caught the conflict, and posting this up here gets everyone else who had a similar curiosity the opportunity to see the question answered; I still think the ship's profile is a little misleading. Still curious about list capacity for taking Captured ships at the start of the game, and what happens when one captures Carriers and the like (that is, does a Pathogen Captured Large "digest" their SRS)?
  16. So, if I take 6 Aureii, I can't take the maximum allotment of 4 Stems, only 2? And I'd have to either wait to capture more, or split? This seems odd; there are plenty of other squadrons (virtually every other Tier 1) in the game with a Squadron Size of 1, which can take Accompaniments without issue. Why is Pathogen the only fleet in the game where Accompaniments count toward the Squadron Size maximum?
  17. OK, missed that Regroup can't target Tier 1s. So, another question. Say my two squadrons of Chaga Cruisers (the fully grown Cruisers, that is) each have an odd game: both of them have captured two enemy Larges, and then been shot down to one Cruiser. So, I have two squadrons of one Chaga, and two Captured Larges. Since these squadrons both started as Tier 2, can I target the squadrons with Regroup? This puts me at a squadron of two Chaga, four Captured Large. We're still inside the squadron maximum of 6, and it's still technically a Tier 2, yes? EDIT: New question: My squadron of Aureus Frigates (the fully grown Frigates) can be a squadron of up to 6, and have a maximum capture size of (8). Does that mean that if I take four Stem Captured Smalls as Accompaniment, I can't capture and add any ships to the squadron until three of them are dead (bringing the squadron down to 7, so I can add back up to 8), or does this mean that I have a maximum of two captured ships I can add?
  18. So, your suspicion is that if I took a Battleship at 800, thereby filling my requirement for Tier one, and a Captured Large, I couldn't also take a Carrier, since the Captured Large is grabbing the other Tier one slot (and therefore couldn't also take another Captured Large)? That's pretty harsh. I hope that isn't accurate; if so, it pretty definitively precludes taking Captured ships at fleet creation, as the opportunity cost is so high.
  19. Hello folks, seems like my last thread on the subject did not withstand the test of time. The following questions got the following answers, if I recall correctly. I have some more questions, though, so I'm putting this back up. Old Questions: Can Pathogen fleets take normal SRS tokens? No. Can Pathogen fleets take Captured vessels during fleet creation? Yes. New Questions: Do Captured vessels count against Tier maxima, or do they exist outside of it? Given that their designations (listed as "Captured ") aren't in the Tier categories for Fleet creation, I'm given to believe that don't count. What happens when I target two individual Caputured Large vessels with the Regroup TAC Card? For that matter, say I'm having a spectacularly fortunate game, and the two Capture Larges I've taken at fleet creation (whether they counted as two of my Tier 1 choices or not is irrelevant here) have both captured another Large vessel; clearly within their potential squadron limit. Can I combine these two squadrons of two Captured Large in to a single squadron of four Captured Larges, since they still have room for one more? Is there any way to load up SRS tokens on to Captured Large vessels, if one does not take them at fleet creation? Do they come loaded? Do they get SRS tokens if the Large which was captured had that number of SRS tokens, perhaps (I've captured a Large with 3 or more SRS tokens, so they convert along with the new ship)?
  20. That's the thing: plenty of escorts are at least good at that. Our escorts are good at only one thing (and not even particularly so), and you have to build your force around that one thing, and you can still only legitimately do that one thing once per game. Higher PD values are applicable any time you're shot at with torps. Systems network on our escorts isn't actually a strength, either, since a decent PD value, which a lot of escorts take for granted, will do the same thing SysNet does anyway: protect you from turn 1 or 2 torpedo fire. SysNet, however, stops after turn 1 or 2, whereas a higher PD value stays solid throughout the game, and also helps shoot down SRS tokens (a strong threat to Tier 1 ships). Our escorts are pretty terrible. Oh, well. Edit: what he said.
  21. Our Escorts were a missed opportunity, I think. It's a shame. Future updates, perhaps?
  22. That's an interesting approach; what appeals to you about it? I try to always have a 6-Wing SRS token to ensure I can reliably put damage on Battleships, as I just write (at least) one Wing off per attack run. 15 dice is what you need to throw to make totally certain you're going to crit the big boys, meaning my 2 Wings, if I take them, are relegated to Interceptors (hardly a terrible fate). If you're tossing out a 5-token, and you get shot down to 4, do you find that only 12 dice does what you need it to? That doesn't reliably crit battleships (or even a lot of carriers), so I'm assuming you're sending your SRS to attack Cruisers. Is that correct? What else in your fleet takes out their Tier 1s?
  23. True, but neither will reliably crit most battleships with full AD. If either token takes any attrition, you struggle to crit cruisers at that point. It's better to frontload one token as much as possible. We don't have the Wing-space to double-up on SRS (we only get close with a pair of Banes accompanying, and even then it's iffy).
  24. Actually, Mssr is short for the French "monseiur," or mister, in English. These forums ate my usual handle, MrKittens, so when I tried again, I went for extra-silly with the name. Not with my avatar, however. My avatar is extra-serious. You can tell because of the top hat, and all the gravitas. Gravitas.
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